Ending the Riley Nelson is a "good QB" debate

[SpiffCoug]

The fact still remains the "stats and facts" in the original post were not factually or statistically correct. The premise of his argument was based on incorrect and faulty data.

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[Brayden Green]

The fact still remains the "stats and facts" in the original post were not factually or statistically correct. The premise of his argument was based on incorrect and faulty data.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

You are better than this Spiff. At least, I think you are.

I **ONLY** used numbers from his starts as I mentioned in the beginning paragraph. Because we are judging him as a starter, not as a "bench player."

The defensive numbers are end of season rankings in "Total Defense" that I took from cfbstats.com

Riley's in game statistics I got from byucougars.com

I didn't fudge any of the numbers. Unlike some of you in this thread. The raw numbers are damning enough to RN.

And as for "throwing out" any games, like the Florida St game, I don't see the need to. Who cares if he passed 4 times, or 40 times? He still started the game, and attempted those passes.

Also, Wazzu isn't ranked 100th, according to CFBstats. They are 102, which some have pointed out, that "top 100" is a VERY, VERY broad base. I am not going to just throw the "Wazzu's" and "Idaho's" of the world. You should be good enough to throw against a top 100 defense as a starter at BYU. There is no excuse there.

[SpiffCoug]

The fact still remains the "stats and facts" in the original post were not factually or statistically correct. The premise of his argument was based on incorrect and faulty data.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

You are better than this Spiff. At least, I think you are.

I **ONLY** used numbers from his starts as I mentioned in the beginning paragraph. Because we are judging him as a starter, not as a "bench player."

The defensive numbers are end of season rankings in "Total Defense" that I took from cfbstats.com

Riley's in game statistics I got from byucougars.com

I didn't fudge any of the numbers. Unlike some of you in this thread. The raw numbers are damning enough to RN.

And as for "throwing out" any games, like the Florida St game, I don't see the need to. Who cares if he passed 4 times, or 40 times? He still started the game, and attempted those passes.

Also, Wazzu isn't ranked 100thdaccording to CFBstats. They are 102, which some have pointed out, that "top 100" is a VERY, VERY broad base. I am not going to just throw the "Wazzu's" and "Idaho's" of the world. You should be good enough to throw against a top 100 defense as a starter at BYU. There is no excuse there.

You can't just average PER like you did. Because that's not how average PER is calculated. And to compare his PER to top 100 total defenses, to me doesn't make much sense. It makes more sense to compare PER to PER defense. And as you could see, Riley was pretty much an average QB.

Of course you wouldn't want to discount the FSU game, because Riley didn't play well on the four passes he attempted. Of course, even though Riley threw six times the number of passes against Utah St (a Top 50 D) we certainly wouldn't want to count those passes he threw, because he was extremely good in that game.

And by your own definition you didn't even count all the Top 100 Total Ds Riley faced. You didn't count San Jose St (#93), Hawaii (#66). So you either selectively chose to discount those games because RIley was quite good in the, or you weren't very thorough in your tabulation of your statistics.

Riley was/is now 5-5 in those games by your definition. As I said in a another thread, after responding your thread and getting in into Riley's numbers, I've come to the determination that Riley is an average QB.

Being fair to him is the least we can do.

[BoiseBYU]

The fact still remains the "stats and facts" in the original post were not factually or statistically correct. The premise of his argument was based on incorrect and faulty data.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

You are better than this Spiff. At least, I think you are.

I **ONLY** used numbers from his starts as I mentioned in the beginning paragraph. Because we are judging him as a starter, not as a "bench player."

The defensive numbers are end of season rankings in "Total Defense" that I took from cfbstats.com

Riley's in game statistics I got from byucougars.com

I didn't fudge any of the numbers. Unlike some of you in this thread. The raw numbers are damning enough to RN.

And as for "throwing out" any games, like the Florida St game, I don't see the need to. Who cares if he passed 4 times, or 40 times? He still started the game, and attempted those passes.

Also, Wazzu isn't ranked 100thdaccording to CFBstats. They are 102, which some have pointed out, that "top 100" is a VERY, VERY broad base. I am not going to just throw the "Wazzu's" and "Idaho's" of the world. You should be good enough to throw against a top 100 defense as a starter at BYU. There is no excuse there.

You can't just average PER like you did. Because that's not how average PER is calculated. And to compare his PER to top 100 total defenses, to me doesn't make much sense. It makes more sense to compare PER to PER defense. And as you could see, Riley was pretty much an average QB.

Of course you wouldn't want to discount the FSU game, because Riley didn't play well on the four passes he attempted. Of course, even though Riley threw six times the number of passes against Utah St (a Top 50 D) we certainly wouldn't want to count those passes he threw, because he was extremely good in that game.

And by your own definition you didn't even count all the Top 100 Total Ds Riley faced. You didn't count San Jose St (#93), Hawaii (#66). So you either selectively chose to discount those games because RIley was quite good in the, or you weren't very thorough in your tabulation of your statistics.

Riley was/is now 5-5 in those games by your definition. As I said in a another thread, after responding your thread and getting in into Riley's numbers, I've come to the determination that Riley is an average QB.

Being fair to him is the least we can do.

Amen. Riley is not as bad a QB as some have made him out to be. Being average, he may not be good enough to take us to the elite level we aspire to. I wish we could move on....

[Brayden Green]

I averaged it, and I calculated it. I gave both stats.

Riley is a great qb against d1aa and very poor against elite teams.

I agree with spiff, he is average. He is a placeholder, but everything is being changed, and leveraged to him. Bad coaching.

[nuk13]

I just watched hi lights of the 2011 season. One was of Nelson throwing from the 50 hitting Hoffman (I think) on stride at the end zone.

[Brayden Green]

I just watched hi lights of the 2011 season. One was of Nelson throwing from the 50 hitting Hoffman (I think) on stride at the end zone.

Cool. That was against St Mary's Agricultural School for the deaf, wasn't it?

[Schmoe]

I just watched hi lights of the 2011 season. One was of Nelson throwing from the 50 hitting Hoffman (I think) on stride at the end zone.

Cool. That was against St Mary's Agricultural School for the deaf, wasn't it?

C'mon, BIB, you know your alma mater doesn't have a football team

[Cougs_Rule]

I just watched hi lights of the 2011 season. One was of Nelson throwing from the 50 hitting Hoffman (I think) on stride at the end zone.

Nuk, you may not know this, but statistical anomalies and outliers are usually removed from the data set as being invalid, attributable to unusual or non-recurring cosmic entities.
If we could make lightning strike more than once don't you think they would try it again?

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[cougman]

Riley was/is now 5-5 in those games by your definition. As I said in a another thread, after responding your thread and getting in into Riley's numbers, I've come to the determination that Riley is an average QB.

Being fair to him is the least we can do.

For purposes of debating this, I'll cede that RN is average. When was the last time BYU rolled with an "average" QB? Why would any Cougar Fan defend the decision to be content with an "average" QB?

I got absolutely hammered over a year ago for pointing all of this out about RN when I argued that he had hit his ceiling and how he had reached his potential. Everyone kept telling me how much he would improve (and how much of a hater I was). He is what he always has been. Average.