Vai S tweet says something bigger is coming

[Cougarbib]

Didn't Arizona and Arizona State go through the same problems when they first joined the PAC Whatever? You could argue they have never completely joined the elite of the conference but there have been a few good years amid the loosing seasons. It's no big deal to me to see utah struggle but I don't think that they are doomed to be the dregs of the conference forever.

As for us, if you want to always be the pretenders and have a great record of playing nobody schools and going to a lower tier bowl and complain because no one respects you, well that may be OK for you. I would prefer to play with the big boys and maybe get beat up some but over time we will establish ourselves as a top school.

Go Cougs!

L Hatton
Louisville, KY

I guess that is possible - not necessarily probable - if you define Arizona and ASU as top schools. Now go look up their records and results since about 1974 or whenever it was that they jumped for greener - money is green - pastures.

ASU was the original WAC dominator. Then BYU. Then BSU. If you count MWC, throw TCU and Utah on the list. Note that as any of them started playing more tough opponents, they had more losses. Even BSU taking the baby step up to the watered down MWC.

[Cougarbib]

But the delta is too big. Maybe improved since MWC but not enough to compete in PAC 12, let alone win the conf.

You were correct in your prior post. Their recruiting may have jumped up slightly, initially, but it fell back in 2013 and may be in trouble for 2014 and beyond. PAC membership hurt their recruiting and our recruiting because now Oregon, Stanford, USC, and UCLA are more aware of In-state recruits and have taken some of the top recruits in Utah. Washington will steal one on occasion, and a CAL scholarship academic value may entice one on occasion as well. The state is no longer off the radar.

[mormonrasta]

Man! Looks like recruiting continues to just explode with their PAC-o-Crap affiliation. Now whether or not these transfers were correlated to losing record the last two years; who can say....honestly.... But two losing record seasons, no bowl game--yep, sure is working out for them (eye-roll). And now that Whit doesn't have his BYU bowl game to secure his job, its one more losing season (is this their hardest in three years?) and he will be on a very short list, if not fired. But, he won't make it to a fourth losing season. And without BYU two years running to save his job, he will be done.

So someone needs to remind me why we'd fare better in the B12 than Utah has in the P12? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see us dominate the SEC, but I could see us becoming like Utah if we have to face a brutal schedule every year.

Has Utah's schedule really been tougher than ours the past 2 years?

Are you serious? Our schedule and theirs haven't even been in the same realm. Brutal. Only reason I'm fine staying independent.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

It's the games against the top teams that matter the most.

Since 2011 Utah played 9 teams that finished in the top 25 in a major poll. BYU has also played 9 teams that finished ranked in the same time span.

Utah had the benefit of playing us in 2011 to equal our total. Is Utah's top end schedule superior to ours? Not really. Is their overall schedule better? Yes. But that was in no small part that they had to play us and we had to play them.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[nickdutson]

They are now receiving full amount of shared revenue and they did go to a bowl game their first year in the PAC. I would say their recruiting is better than in the MWC.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

According to the rankings their recruiting has gotten worse since joining the PAC12. I've compiled a list of their rankings back to 2008.

Code: Select all

Year	Rivals		Scout
2015	62 			55
2014	67			69
2013	44			53
2012	28			33 <- First Pac12 bump in recruiting
2011	37			39 <- First season in Pac12
2010	32			34
2009	44			55
2008	60			67

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] And I take recruiting rankings with a grain of salt. BYU and especially Utah have consistently taken 2 star recruits to play at 4 star levels. Year in and year out the recruiting needs change. Right now it appears they are recruiting speed and hope to train the recruits up. Oregon does much of the same.

So in other words, they are better, but in no quantifiable way either on or off the field.

By the way, Oregon's ratings have been 22, 21, 17, 15, 13. So they may do it much the same, but the difference is Oregon recruits better talent by a wide margin.

So recruiting rankings should reflect record rankings. TCU, Tennessee, ole miss, Mississippi state, Michigan to name a few that are consistently top 30 recruiting rankings have sucked lately. Even Texas has been horrible with top 5 rankings nearly every year. Quit relying on numbers. Jake heaps definitely isn't quantifiable of his rank.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Cougarbib]

Man! Looks like recruiting continues to just explode with their PAC-o-Crap affiliation. Now whether or not these transfers were correlated to losing record the last two years; who can say....honestly.... But two losing record seasons, no bowl game--yep, sure is working out for them (eye-roll). And now that Whit doesn't have his BYU bowl game to secure his job, its one more losing season (is this their hardest in three years?) and he will be on a very short list, if not fired. But, he won't make it to a fourth losing season. And without BYU two years running to save his job, he will be done.

So someone needs to remind me why we'd fare better in the B12 than Utah has in the P12? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see us dominate the SEC, but I could see us becoming like Utah if we have to face a brutal schedule every year.

Has Utah's schedule really been tougher than ours the past 2 years?

Are you serious? Our schedule and theirs haven't even been in the same realm. Brutal. Only reason I'm fine staying independent.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Now go count Top 10 opponents. Those are sure losses for almost any team.



It's the games against the top teams that matter the most.

Since 2011 Utah played 9 teams that finished in the top 25 in a major poll. BYU has also played 9 teams that finished ranked in the same time span.

Utah had the benefit of playing us in 2011 to equal our total. Is Utah's top end schedule superior to ours? Not really. Is their overall schedule better? But that was in no small part that they had to play us and we had to play them.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Count Top 10 Opponents the last 2 or 3 years. Top 10 opponents are usually sure losses for almost any team - Stanford exception notwithstanding.

Go with final season rankings. Best test of how good an opponent really was.

[Cougarbib]

They are now receiving full amount of shared revenue and they did go to a bowl game their first year in the PAC. I would say their recruiting is better than in the MWC.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

According to the rankings their recruiting has gotten worse since joining the PAC12. I've compiled a list of their rankings back to 2008.

Code: Select all

Year	Rivals		Scout
2015	62 			55
2014	67			69
2013	44			53
2012	28			33 <- First Pac12 bump in recruiting
2011	37			39 <- First season in Pac12
2010	32			34
2009	44			55
2008	60			67

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] And I take recruiting rankings with a grain of salt. BYU and especially Utah have consistently taken 2 star recruits to play at 4 star levels. Year in and year out the recruiting needs change. Right now it appears they are recruiting speed and hope to train the recruits up. Oregon does much of the same.

So in other words, they are better, but in no quantifiable way either on or off the field.

By the way, Oregon's ratings have been 22, 21, 17, 15, 13. So they may do it much the same, but the difference is Oregon recruits better talent by a wide margin.

So recruiting rankings should reflect record rankings. TCU, Tennessee, ole miss, Mississippi state, Michigan to name a few that are consistently top 30 recruiting rankings have sucked lately. Even Texas has been horrible with top 5 rankings nearly every year. Quit relying on numbers. Jake heaps definitely isn't quantifiable of his rank.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Recruiting rankings are correct on average most of the time. Sure there are exceptions. And, it takes 2 or 3 years for a recruiting class to pay off - longer at BYU due to missions.

Texas, for example is not Top 5 every year. 2014 should prove to be a good combination of 2011 and 2012 talent and 2 or 3 years of experience. Last year - inexperience. If the coaching and scheme change does not totally annul that experience, Texas should improve.

TCU simply proves that Top 35 classes were fine to dominate the MWC, but make you pretty oordinary in a P5 conference - especially with injured or arrested starting QBs.

2010 46, impact biggest in 2013
2011 26, impact biggest in 2014
2012 37, impact biggest in 2015
2013 30, impact biggest in 2016

TCU is highly ranked going into 2014 - might be that #26 recruiting class 3 years ago.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[mormonrasta]

Man! Looks like recruiting continues to just explode with their PAC-o-Crap affiliation. Now whether or not these transfers were correlated to losing record the last two years; who can say....honestly.... But two losing record seasons, no bowl game--yep, sure is working out for them (eye-roll). And now that Whit doesn't have his BYU bowl game to secure his job, its one more losing season (is this their hardest in three years?) and he will be on a very short list, if not fired. But, he won't make it to a fourth losing season. And without BYU two years running to save his job, he will be done.

So someone needs to remind me why we'd fare better in the B12 than Utah has in the P12? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see us dominate the SEC, but I could see us becoming like Utah if we have to face a brutal schedule every year.

Has Utah's schedule really been tougher than ours the past 2 years?

Are you serious? Our schedule and theirs haven't even been in the same realm. Brutal. Only reason I'm fine staying independent.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Now go count Top 10 opponents. Those are sure losses for almost any team.



It's the games against the top teams that matter the most.

Since 2011 Utah played 9 teams that finished in the top 25 in a major poll. BYU has also played 9 teams that finished ranked in the same time span.

Utah had the benefit of playing us in 2011 to equal our total. Is Utah's top end schedule superior to ours? Not really. Is their overall schedule better? But that was in no small part that they had to play us and we had to play them.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Count Top 10 Opponents the last 2 or 3 years. Top 10 opponents are usually sure losses for almost any team - Stanford exception notwithstanding.

Go with final season rankings. Best test of how good an opponent really was.

I was going with final season rankings.

As far as the final top 10 Utah played 3 BYU 1.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Cougarbib]

Has Utah's schedule really been tougher than ours the past 2 years?[/quote]
Are you serious? Our schedule and theirs haven't even been in the same realm. Brutal. Only reason I'm fine staying independent.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] [/quote]

Now go count Top 10 opponents. Those are sure losses for almost any team.



It's the games against the top teams that matter the most.

Since 2011 Utah played 9 teams that finished in the top 25 in a major poll. BYU has also played 9 teams that finished ranked in the same time span.

Utah had the benefit of playing us in 2011 to equal our total. Is Utah's top end schedule superior to ours? Not really. Is their overall schedule better? But that was in no small part that they had to play us and we had to play them.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] [/quote]

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Count Top 10 Opponents the last 2 or 3 years. Top 10 opponents are usually sure losses for almost any team - Stanford exception notwithstanding.

Go with final season rankings. Best test of how good an opponent really was.[/quote]

I was going with final season rankings.

As far as the final top 10 Utah played 3 BYU 1.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] [/quote][/quote]

3 to 1 nearly sure losses.

Now count nearly sure wins. That will be the other 2 or 3 to 1 difference. UVA proved you can lose a nearly sure win, but draw a line at about 85 or worse final ranking and count them up.

This year BYU may have as many as 6 or 7, thus assuring bowl eligibility. Utah may have as few as 2-3.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Gunk]

Did we ever learn what the "big" news from Vai was? Sorry to bring this thread back to the original topic...

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Cougarbib]

Did we ever learn what the "big" news from Vai was? Sorry to bring this thread back to the original topic...

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

Good idea. I am thinking the freshman linebacker Takitaki being dismissed with more suspensions rumored was the news.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]