Rose and the post season

[hawkwing]

Hawk is just filling the void Bib left. I don't fault Hawk for setting Bronco as the gold standard as long as he doesn't mind me nitpicking Bronco (who hasn't done anything on a national level or beaten a Top 5 opponent in half a decade).

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I am not basing my criticisms on Rose on some weird attempt to credit or defend Bronco. I'm sorry thatwe can't have a conversation about Roses faults without everyone jumping to point out what Bronco does or doesn't do.

Let's leave Bronco out of this entirely and discuss Rose. Bronco won't be here in 2 years anyway, so who cares about what he is or isn't?

Then let's quibble about the outlandish exageration of "completely" Outcoached in the last three games. And since I don't think you are Likely to defend your opinion, then let's ask why you are prone to do use gross exagerations against Rose , but not Bronco.

Your inability to read what I wrote, but instead blow up at the audacity someone would defend a coach you don't like by pointing out weaknesses in one you do has gotten you confused. I never said he was out coached in the last 3 games.

[Brayden Green]

I think any time you lose a 17 point lead, 100% of the momentum, and use up all of your timeouts before the final few plays when you may need to set up a play for a game tying or winning shot, and also give up 6 dunks on the same baseline pass play, that's being out coached.

I'm asking you honestly here: you don't think in one of those timeouts he talked to his players about that play?

The team never adjusted to it nor changed the way they countered it, so either he didn't or he didn't do it effectively.

That's the point. BYU has NO counter to that play. Once you allow your guard to pentrate the game is over. That's why they don't play zone in the nba.

It was open in the first half too. Ole Miss recognized it in the second half and exploited it. Game over.

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[snoscythe]

Then let's quibble about the outlandish exageration of "completely" Outcoached in the last three games.

Point of order, because I think you are misreading Hawkwing's OP.

Hawkwing said Rose was completely outcoached in three postseason games this year. I assume he is referring to Ole Miss, Gonzaga, and Santa Clara.

You keep referring to the "last three games," which replaces Santa Clara (a 2-point last minute win over a 14-18 team) with the Portland game (a 14-point win over a 18-14 team).

If Hawkwing were including the Portland game, I would agree that it's outlandish to suggest he was outcoached in that easy win. But if he's referring to SCU, Gonzaga, and Ole Miss, I think there's a good argument that Rose was outmaneuvered in each of those games, and only a decided talent advantage prevented the SCU game from going down as a loss.

Just trying to clear the air a bit--go back and read the OP.

[Cougs_Rule]

Then let's quibble about the outlandish exageration of "completely" Outcoached in the last three games.

Point of order, because I think you are misreading Hawkwing's OP.

Hawkwing said Rose was completely outcoached in three postseason games this year. I assume he is referring to Ole Miss, Gonzaga, and Santa Clara.

You keep referring to the "last three games," which replaces Santa Clara (a 2-point last minute win over a 14-18 team) with the Portland game (a 14-point win over a 18-14 team).

If Hawkwing were including the Portland game, I would agree that it's outlandish to suggest he was outcoached in that easy win. But if he's referring to SCU, Gonzaga, and Ole Miss, I think there's a good argument that Rose was outmaneuvered in each of those games, and only a decided talent advantage prevented the SCU game from going down as a loss.

Just trying to clear the air a bit--go back and read the OP.

such loyalty among the mods. Such cover up. We all know he is referring to the last three games, including Miss. And he most certainly wrote " completely outcoached". Not the milder more moderate, "out maneuvered". So point of order back at Ya.

[Cougs_Rule]

Hawk is just filling the void Bib left. I don't fault Hawk for setting Bronco as the gold standard as long as he doesn't mind me nitpicking Bronco (who hasn't done anything on a national level or beaten a Top 5 opponent in half a decade).

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

I am not basing my criticisms on Rose on some weird attempt to credit or defend Bronco. I'm sorry thatwe can't have a conversation about Roses faults without everyone jumping to point out what Bronco does or doesn't do.

Let's leave Bronco out of this entirely and discuss Rose. Bronco won't be here in 2 years anyway, so who cares about what he is or isn't?

Then let's quibble about the outlandish exageration of "completely" Outcoached in the last three games. And since I don't think you are Likely to defend your opinion, then let's ask why you are prone to do use gross exagerations against Rose , but not Bronco.

Your inability to read what I wrote, but instead blow up at the audacity someone would defend a coach you don't like by pointing out weaknesses in one you do has gotten you confused. I never said he was out coached in the last 3 games.

You are right. You said " completely outcoached."

[byufan4ever]

All Rose has to do is make the NCAA Tournament and BYU fans are giddy. If Bronco isn't winning championships then gosh dam it he better high tail it and leave town cause we don't want him.

I know this isn't where Hawking wanted the conversation to go, but...I think that both Bronco and Rose are good, but not great coaches. And by this time I don't think either ever will be a great coach. They both have great winning percentages, but neither have gotten us far in the postseason.They are probably the best that BYU can get and they both have difficult recruiting handicaps.

To be a great coach here's what I want (Besides a championship of course):

Football - January Bowl
Basketball - Final Four

Bronco and Rose have BOTH been good coaches. Not great coaches, not bad coaches, not average coaches. Good, but not great I think summarizes both of our coaches. They've helped turn around our programs, but I don't think that they are capable of getting our teams to the next elite level.

I honestly try to be fair to both Bronco and Rose but it probably looks like I pick on Rose more because I feel like he gets greater slack from fans than Bronco does. Just a perception and perhaps an incorrect one.

[Gunk]

Blame, is a mixed bag. Coaches need to prep and players need to execute.

Given the tools Rose had to work with this season, he should be commended for getting the team to the NCAA tourney and beating the #3 team in the nation (how soon we forget). You can basically count on one hand the number of teams that have beaten Gonzaga on their home court in the last ten years.

A healthy Winder and we win tonight.

As frustrating as it was to watch, Rose didn't have many options. Who was he going to play instead of Bartley? Nixon? Sorry, would rather watch the freight train that is Bartley. Backup PG? Best option was the smallest player on the court.

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[Schmoe]

Maybe Bartley is his only option, as Gunk poses, but maybe there could have been more work put into Bartley by the coaching staff to make him a better player than he was today on the court?

[Cougs_Rule]

All Rose has to do is make the NCAA Tournament and BYU fans are giddy. If Bronco isn't winning championships then gosh dam it he better high tail it and leave town cause we don't want him.

I know this isn't where Hawking wanted the conversation to go, but...I think that both Bronco and Rose are good, but not great coaches. And by this time I don't think either ever will be a great coach. They both have great winning percentages, but neither have gotten us far in the postseason.They are probably the best that BYU can get and they both have difficult recruiting handicaps.

To be a great coach here's what I want (Besides a championship of course):

Football - January Bowl
Basketball - Final Four

Bronco and Rose have BOTH been good coaches. Not great coaches, not bad coaches, not average coaches. Good, but not great I think summarizes both of our coaches. They've helped turn around our programs, but I don't think that they are capable of getting our teams to the next elite level.

I honestly try to be fair to both Bronco and Rose but it probably looks like I pick on Rose more because I feel like he gets greater slack from fans than Bronco does. Just a perception and perhaps an incorrect one.

Such honesty. Credit you, dude. You simply confessed what I have been pointing out to others who don't want to admit it. I'd Hang it up if others were so transparent.

[Gunk]

All Rose has to do is make
the NCAA Tournament and BYU fans are giddy. If Bronco isn't winning championships then gosh dam it he better high tail it and leave town cause we don't want him.

I know this isn't where Hawking wanted the conversation to go, but...I think that both Bronco and Rose are good, but not great coaches. And by this time I don't think either ever will be a great coach. They both have great winning percentages, but neither have gotten us far in the postseason.They are probably the best that BYU can get and they both have difficult recruiting handicaps.

To be a great coach here's what I want (Besides a championship of course):

Football - January Bowl
Basketball - Final Four

Bronco and Rose have BOTH been good coaches. Not great coaches, not bad coaches, not average coaches. Good, but not great I think summarizes both of our coaches. They've helped turn around our programs, but I don't think that they are capable of getting our teams to the next elite level.

I honestly try to be fair to both Bronco and Rose but it probably looks like I pick on Rose more because I feel like he gets greater slack from fans than Bronco does. Just a perception and perhaps an incorrect one.

BYU fans suffer from delusions of grandeur.

You could argue football fans' delusions are founded in that BYU did win a national "title" some 30 years ago, but that season was clearly an outlier.

Basketball has never gotten to the Final 4. We've gone the Elite 8 just three times and the Sweet 16 only seven times.

If past successes are the barometer, then holding Rose to a Final 4 appearance is high.

Fact of the matter is BYU isn't a sports juggernaut as much as we would like them to be. We don't get the athletes and the coaches are good to great but not elite.

Rose has the team on the right track. His run is quite good for a BYU head coach. He has his faults. I look forward to watching his teams. Perhaps my expectations are low, but when I went to BYU, the team went 1 - 25.

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