Trotter: Big XII Expansion Inevitable

[Fido]

It would be a disappointment to see some P5 conference expansion that didn't include BYU--but I'm not losing sleep over it. BYU appears destined for independence for the foreseeable future and I'm okay with that. I've always been a little leary of the stability in the B12 anyhow and I don't see that resolved--especially if Texas is opposed to expanding and the rest of the league forces it.

I agree with this. However, Holmoe has said that independence is not sustainable long term. That has me concerned.

As I recall, the context of that statement was concerning finances as an independent vs. finances as a P5 conference member. Meaning they could not sustain a P5 budget as an independent since they do not bring in a comparable amount--so they would fall behind of the P5s. I don't believe that statement applied to joining up with a G5 conference vs. staying independence.

[a1247]

It would bum me out if they didn't get invited. I would love to see team's from the B12 playing at LES every year. I love the conference affiliation and the rivalries that come from playing in a conference. Long term independence isn't the answer. And going back to the MWC would suck! Maybe Boise and BYU could get together and somehow get into the B12 as package deal.

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[lawngnome]

One downside to a Big 12 invite would be the travel, obviously travel killed the Cougars early in the season with so many road games so far away. That could possibly change if they joined the conference, but I doubt they would get special consideration. Traveling that far every other week takes its toll and many times they would travel back to back weeks. It would be tough.

Although the travel as an independent hasn't been great so far either.
Just my two cents.

[YNot]

Travel has been one of the big benefits of independence. The exposure and access to nationwide fans is incredible. BYU has and will continue to play all over the country - California, Mountain West, Texas, Midwest, South, and East Coast.

Check out the road games from 2012 through 2022...

California (12): Cal, UCLA, Fresno St., SJSU (x2) - USC and Stanford (x2), Poinsettia (x3) and Fight Hunger Bowls

Mountain West (10): Boise St. (x4), NMSU, Nevada - UNLV, Arizona, ASU, Las Vegas Bowl

Midwest (11): Notre Dame (x2), Wisconsin (x2), Nebraska, Michigan, Missouri, - Michigan St., Cincinnati, NIU, Toledo

South (9): Virginia (x2), Georgia Tech, MTSU, UCF, - Mississippi St., ECU, USF - Miami Beach Bowl

East Coast (4): UConn, WVU in Maryland, UMass (x2),

Texas (3): Texas, Houston, LSU in Houston,

Games with opponents from all the major conference and nearly all FBS conferences:

PAC 12: 28
ACC/Notre Dame: 7
B1G: 7
SEC: 5
Big 12: 3
MWC: 33
AAC: 13
MAC: 4
CUSA: 1
Sun Belt: 0

IMO, it would be a shame if BYU gave up games all over the country against Boise St., Utah, UCLA, USC, Stanford, Arizona, Washington, Oregon, Wisconsin, LSU, Nebraska, Michigan St., Missouri, Mississippi St., Virginia, etc. for the Big 12 schedule - which would have as much Kansas, Kansas St., and Iowa St., as it would Texas, Oklahoma, and TCU...

[Yzzazz]

Would Big XII taking in BYU leave BYU with more money or less?

That's the question I'd like to see answered.

BYU's ESPN deal is pretty lucrative, and unless BYU makes it into the playoffs, I have a hard time seeing how bXII membership gives them MORE money. I'd imagine they'd end up with net LESS money.

BYU played in the Rose Bowl and in the Big House, as well as playing in Lincoln and later in Arrowhead stadium. Maybe I'm wrong but that sounds like a better list of venues that what they'd get in the Big XII.

We keep scheduling the way we are now and the playoff picture will arrive for us eventually. Do we really need to accept less money being in a conference so that our chances of making the playoffs can jump from 5% to 10%?

I kinda favor independence right now.

[a1247]

Would Big XII taking in BYU leave BYU with more money or less?

That's the question I'd like to see answered.

BYU's ESPN deal is pretty lucrative, and unless BYU makes it into the playoffs, I have a hard time seeing how bXII membership gives them MORE money. I'd imagine they'd end up with net LESS money.

BYU played in the Rose Bowl and in the Big House, as well as playing in Lincoln and later in Arrowhead stadium. Maybe I'm wrong but that sounds like a better list of venues that what they'd get in the Big XII.

We keep scheduling the way we are now and the playoff picture will arrive for us eventually. Do we really need to accept less money being in a conference so that our chances of making the playoffs can jump from 5% to 10%?

I kinda favor independence right now.

A Google search says each of the B12 members made 23 million in 2014. Another Google search says ESPN pays BYU 800,000-1.2 million per home game. Now even at 1.2 million per home game that's far bellow 23 million. Why would Tom Holmoe keep saying they can't compete financially long term against the P5's if they where making anything close to the same money?

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[Cougs_Rule]

But what did Neraska pay BYU, like 1 million? What did Michigan pay? its not bad bucks, but its not the big bucks. Not even half. So, maybe that is why TH is selling out this team? Question is, how much BYU pay back to get bigger teams in Provo? Wait, what bigteams have come?

[YNot]

Would Big XII taking in BYU leave BYU with more money or less?

More, and it's not close. The Big 12 distributed $23 million per school from the Big 12 TV deal, CFP money (Big 12 gets about 20% of the pot), and NCAA tournament credits.

BYU makes about $6-8 million from the ESPN football deal, WCC TV deal, NCAA tournament credits, and CFP money (about $200K, right?). Even with a couple million from Nebraska and Michigan type payday games, that figure caps off at less than half of what the Big 12 could deliver.

Plus, BYU would have more home sellouts in both football and basketball playing in the Big 12. BYU was well below its annual average in home football attendance at 57K per game last year. Average attendance would likely shoot back to 64K capacity per game in the Big 12. That's 7,000 more tickets over 6 games - mostly straight to profits.

BYU basketball averaged about 15.8K per home game. In the Big 12, you would see BYU's average game closer to its 19K capacity. That could be 3,000 more tickets over 15 games - again, mostly straight to profits.

IMO, independent football schedules will continue to improve and we will see more capacity crowds. UCLA, Utah, Wisconsin, USC, Michigan St., Mississippi St., Missouri, and others come to LES over the next few seasons.

WCC basketball home schedules will continue to be hit and miss.

BYU played in the Rose Bowl and in the Big House, as well as playing in Lincoln and later in Arrowhead stadium. Maybe I'm wrong but that sounds like a better list of venues that what they'd get in the Big XII.

The great road games continue into the future. West Virginia at Landover, Arizona in Glendale, LSU in Houston, UMass in Gillette - all NFL venues - and Michigan St., USC, Stanford, Oregon, Washington, Wisconsin, Mississippi St., Virginia, and the like provide better experiences than most of what the Big 12 can provide. BYU's Big 12 road slate would include a lot of trips to Ames, Lawrence, Stillwater, Waco, and Lubbock.

[hawkwing]

BYU makes about $6-8 million from the ESPN football deal, WCC TV deal, NCAA tournament credits, and CFP money (about $200K, right?). Even with a couple million from Nebraska and Michigan type payday games, that figure caps off at less than half of what the Big 12 could deliver.

I think the deal is minimum of 8 and can go up to 12ish million for the ESPN TV deal. But your point still stands, we are getting about 1/2 of what we could be getting.

[a1247]

But what did Neraska pay BYU, like 1 million? What did Michigan pay?

Those teams pay almost all there non conference opponent's that kind of money to come to there stadium without a return visit to the other teams field. Especially on college football's opening weekend. But the LSU's and Alabamas of the college football world are not hurting enough to need those types of payouts like a non P5 program. So BYU could be in a major conference and still get those type of payouts on top of the conference money if they so desired.

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