BYU Receiving Corps

Watching the Utah game, I noticed that despite Max having some time, his receivers just weren't open. Much credit needs to be given to utah's defensive scheme but it seems as though their defenders were just more athletic than our wide receivers.



I felt like that was our biggest problem on offense in the Utah game. Will these guys be better next year given their youth or are they just not fast enough?

it's a matter of physicality and technique. They need to learn how to fight off the holding, and subtly pushoff, because Utah defenders are very hands on, all the way down field. They will never let go, because they know they will never get called for it.

This is also a problem with our offensive system. The easiest way to free someone up from bump pressure is to send them in motion. We rarely use motion. Also you can line people up in different places in your formation and move them in motion to where you want them to be. For example, a couple of times Collie lined up as a runningback and then was motioned out as a receiver. The result is you likely end up with a safety or even better a linebacker on your best player. Didn't see that done at all this year...

they should be better next year. Chambers, Jacobsen and hafoka return, while hoffman and Apo join the fray. This will be the biggest/most athletic group of wideouts we've had at the Y in a long time.

getting better and better

jonnylingo wrote:
Watching the Utah game, I noticed that despite Max having some time, his receivers just weren't open. Much credit needs to be given to utah's defensive scheme but it seems as though their defenders were just more athletic than our wide receivers. I felt like that was our biggest problem on offense in the Utah game.

I wanted to see two things in the Utah game: Either run the ball with Harvey in the I-Formation, or throw it in Max Protect (keeping George/Kariya home to block while Jacobsen/Pitta/OC get open).



IMO, by far our biggest problem against Utah was our O-Line. They got absolutely OWNED. D-Linemen were breathing down Hall's neck all game long. I have no idea how many balls were batted down, but A LOT were. Screens were sometimes the only way out there (which we didn't do at all against TCU)...

The receivers (excluding the TEs) are the weakest part of the offense by far. It doesn't really matter when you have a really good QB, TEs, and RB unless you are playing elite defenses like TCU.

mormonrasta wrote:
The receivers (excluding the TEs) are the weakest part of the offense by far. It doesn't really matter when you have a really good QB, TEs, and RB unless you are playing elite defenses like TCU.

They're also the youngest group on our team.

For the last two years, our WRs and TEs have simply been unable to get open against either TCU or Utah. Max faced probably his fierecest pass rush against both teams and when he did get time he had no one open to throw to.

kitic77 wrote:
For the last two years, our WRs and TEs have simply been unable to get open against either TCU or Utah. Max faced probably his fierecest pass rush against both teams and when he did get time he had no one open to throw to.

The answer to that is simple. Run the ball and throw on the play action. The last 2 years we abandoned the run against Utah even though it was successful.

Good points. But I still think our receivers struggle to get off the line against press coverage. I don't know what we can do differently, but clearly the way our receivers attempt to do it now does not work. To me it sounds like both a player and coaching issue.

also don't forget that Ashworth dropped a TD pass in the endzone and also a wide open 3rd down conversion. Two major drops.



It's unfortunate that max had to run so much during the U game, but give him credit for gaining yards when no one was open.

CougarClaw wrote:
also don't forget that Ashworth dropped a TD pass in the endzone and also a wide open 3rd down conversion. Two major drops.



It's unfortunate that max had to run so much during the U game, but give him credit for gaining yards when no one was open.

I don't think you can call that pass in the endzone a dropped ball. Had Max thrown it better it would have easily been a TD. Even if he catches it i'm not sure he's inbounds anyway. Max was off all night and was not very accurate. Even some of the "drops" were bad passes and had they been thrown more accurately would have been easy completions.

He would have been in bounds and it was indeed a dropped ball. He had it in his hands. That doesn't mean that it wasn't a bad throw from Max or that I blame Luke for not catching it. But he's certainly capable. His other drop in the middle of the field though he should have had. No excuse on that one.



As for our receiving corps, this year may have been the most talented group as a whole we have ever had. And next year will be even better. Austin Collie is by far and away the best receiver to have ever come through the program, but we've never been as deep and talented as we have been this season.



Chambers will be an absolute terror next year. McKay will blow by everyone with his 4.3 speed. Ashworth will make us think Austin Collie has somehow come back for his last year of eligibility. Hafoka provides another dependable option. Apo might just end up being the most productive receiver ever at BYU.



The reason our guys weren't able to get open more against TCU or Yewtah was because I don't think they've seen the kind of physical man coverage the pukes were playing. They were just getting out-physicaled at the line. There were guys open that Max would probably have ordinarily thrown too but I think he was trying to be overly cautious in not forcing anything that might result in a turnover (in both the TCU and Yewtah games). TCU also completely out-coached us. It's like they had someone in our game scripting sessions all week leading up to the game. They just always knew what we we're going to do. But the coaches did much better against the pukes.

gmj81 wrote:
Chambers will be an absolute terror next year. McKay will blow by everyone with his 4.3 speed. Ashworth will make us think Austin Collie has somehow come back for his last year of eligibility. Hafoka provides another dependable option. Apo might just end up being the most productive receiver ever at BYU.

Chambers will be a beast, and Hafoka does provide another dependable option, but I don't think Ashworth is going to make anyone think of Austin Collie (except to say "Ashworth is nothing like Collie"). I actually expect Hoffman to take many of the reps that Ashworth has been getting this year. He's bigger, faster, and more athletic than Ashworth is. Aside from Apo, Hoffman has more upside than any other receiver in the program.



I've been a big fan of McKay Jacobsen, but I'm not sure he's as fast as they say he is. I spent much of the Utah game watching him, and he found himself in single coverage much of the night (due to the bracket coverage that Pitta/George had been drawing) with no safety help over the top. Jacobsen wasn't exactly running away from Utah's corners. There were opportunities (single coverage) for long plays, but Jacobsen never did break open. He's really elusive in the open field, and I'm sure he's a legit low 4.5 guy, but he doesn't seem to be the real burner (sub 4.5 guy) that we'd hoped he was. We'll see.



The sky is the limit for Apo...I don't think we've ever had a receiver recruit like him. We've ever had a wideout with his combination of size, speed, hands, and route running ability. He will definitely see the field early.

I want to disagree on this one. I think part of the problem lies with Max, part with how we use the WR in this offense. Max goes to the line, makes a read, then dials in on 1 receiver based upon that read. 90% of the time, Max looks right first, and he NEVER throws the ball to the WR on the far field side. Ever. Typically that first read guy is Pitta. Then George, Then maybe a RB, then a WR position player. The WR position run outside patters all day long and rarely venture inside, and I hate that. They are not in position to make plays. In the old BYU offense (yeah, I know) the WR ran across the middle all game long and got open. Now, they never do, we do not attack the middle with that position, and we make it easier for teams to double bracket our TE's and take us out because they can man our WR's who run easy patterns to defend. Put them in motion, run them over the middle, and they will get open. Create mismatches with formation and they will get open. I expect the next BYU QB to utilize them more, like John Beck did. I love Max, but he does have tendencies to lock in on guys. TCU and Utah really took advantage of those tendencies the last few years.

Mithrandir wrote:
Chambers will be a beast, and Hafoka does provide another dependable option, but I don't think Ashworth is going to make anyone think of Austin Collie (except to say "Ashworth is nothing like Collie"). I actually expect Hoffman to take many of the reps that Ashworth has been getting this year. He's bigger, faster, and more athletic than Ashworth is. Aside from Apo, Hoffman has more upside than any other receiver in the program.



I've been a big fan of McKay Jacobsen, but I'm not sure he's as fast as they say he is. I spent much of the Utah game watching him, and he found himself in single coverage much of the night (due to the bracket coverage that Pitta/George had been drawing) with no safety help over the top. Jacobsen wasn't exactly running away from Utah's corners. There were opportunities (single coverage) for long plays, but Jacobsen never did break open. He's really elusive in the open field, and I'm sure he's a legit low 4.5 guy, but he doesn't seem to be the real burner (sub 4.5 guy) that we'd hoped he was. We'll see.



The sky is the limit for Apo...I don't think we've ever had a receiver recruit like him. We've ever had a wideout with his combination of size, speed, hands, and route running ability. He will definitely see the field early.

People, both in the media and members of the team and staff, have already compared Ashworth to Collie back in spring ball and the early part of the season. They have similar builds, speed and hands though Collie ran better routes. How many balls has he had thrown his way though? Not a lot and part of that is due to Max spreading it around a little bit more this season. Another part is just the deeper rotation we have this year while last year it was almost exclusively a 2 receiver rotation between Collie and Reed.



As for Jacobson, he's more than a "legit low 4.5 guy". Upon returning from his mission he was already the fastest guy on the team despite being out of shape. And there are quite a few guys on the squad with 4.5-4.6 speed. By now he's down to the mid-4.4s, not quite down to the high-4.3s he was in high school and his freshman year but by the start of next season he'll be back to form. He is in fact "a burner" and had numerous offers to run track out of high school, even more than he had to play football, and from some of big name schools. Don't forget he's less than a year removed from his mission and has been battling a hamstring pull ever since he got home.

Mithrandir wrote:



The sky is the limit for Apo...I don't think we've ever had a receiver recruit like him. We've ever had a wideout with his combination of size, speed, hands, and route running ability. He will definitely see the field early.

If Chambers was getting play time his freshman year, then Apo will definitely get play time his freshman year.

gmj81 wrote:
People, both in the media and members of the team and staff, have already compared Ashworth to Collie back in spring ball and the early part of the season. They have similar builds, speed and hands though Collie ran better routes.

Yeah, and Chris Hale was "a homerun waiting to happen". Ashworth is a solid posession guy with sure hands, average (even by BYU standards) speed, and a great work ethic. He's simply not the same type of athlete that Collie was, though. He will never have the same type of production that Collie had, and he's not likely to go on to the NFL and generate the same kind of rookie buzz that Collie has generated. That's not to say that I don't love Ashworth...we're both timpview guys...I know his family. But I simply wouldn't compare Ashworth and Collie.

gmj81 wrote:
As for Jacobson, he's more than a "legit low 4.5 guy". Upon returning from his mission he was already the fastest guy on the team despite being out of shape. And there are quite a few guys on the squad with 4.5-4.6 speed. By now he's down to the mid-4.4s, not quite down to the high-4.3s he was in high school and his freshman year but by the start of next season he'll be back to form. He is in fact "a burner".

I guess this remains to be seen. Perhaps his hamstring has slowed him a little...I'll give him the benefit of th doubt. So far, however, he hasn't been the deep threat that I thought he'd become. If hwe were truly runnig in the mid 4.4's, I don't think defenses would be gambling very often on man to man coverage. Even the lousy MWC have seemed unconcerned about MacKay's speed.

Mithrandir wrote:

People, both in the media and members of the team and staff, have already compared Ashworth to Collie back in spring ball and the early part of the season. They have similar builds, speed and hands though Collie ran better routes.

Yeah, and Chris Hale was "a homerun waiting to happen". Ashworth is a solid posession guy with sure hands, average (even by BYU standards) speed, and a great work ethic. He's simply not the same type of athlete that Collie was, though. He will never have the same type of production that Collie had, and he's not likely to go on to the NFL and generate the same kind of rookie buzz that Collie has generated. That's not to say that I don't love Ashworth...we're both timpview guys...I know his family. But I simply wouldn't compare Ashworth and Collie.

Look, all I know is what I read in every summer whispering and fall camp report was this guy was "going to make a lot of people forget about Austin Collie" and "made people do double takes thinking Collie had come back". Those are almost verbatim how I remember them. Maybe he hasn't lived up to those statements yet but he certainly has similar size and build to Collie. They are probably equally as fast. And both have great hands (do you not remember that amazing one handed grab across the middle in coverage against FSU?). Both also have tireless work ethics but clearly Collie just had something a little extra. And his route running couldn't be matched by any other receiver who played his junior year. So maybe Ashworth hasn't blown us all away yet but there's clearly something there that wowed both his teammates and the media prior to the season.

Mithrandir wrote:

As for Jacobson, he's more than a "legit low 4.5 guy". Upon returning from his mission he was already the fastest guy on the team despite being out of shape. And there are quite a few guys on the squad with 4.5-4.6 speed. By now he's down to the mid-4.4s, not quite down to the high-4.3s he was in high school and his freshman year but by the start of next season he'll be back to form. He is in fact "a burner".

I guess this remains to be seen. Perhaps his hamstring has slowed him a little...I'll give him the benefit of th doubt. So far, however, he hasn't been the deep threat that I thought he'd become. If hwe were truly runnig in the mid 4.4's, I don't think defenses would be gambling very often on man to man coverage. Even the lousy MWC have seemed unconcerned about MacKay's speed.

You seem to have a funny memory when it comes to McKay's contributions. Don't forget he missed four games in the middle of the season due to that hamstring. Prior to those four he only torched OU's vaunted defense for a 49 yard woulda-been TD if Max hadn't underthrown it, lit up Tulane for a 38 yard TD (also underthrown), smoked FSU's "world-class speed" for an 80 yard TD bomb before not having been used really at all against CSU due to the early lead. He then missed the next four but his first game back he took a 79 yarder to the house against Wyoming, had a 50 yard reception against New Mexico and a 33 yarder against Air Force. The pukes did a pretty good job of playing him physical and jamming him at the line like no other defense faced all year. But on top of that, Max just wasn't taking any chances in that game that could have resulted in a turnover.



Basically you can count on once maybe twice a game Jacobson stretching the field with his speed. The only reason we don't do it more often is that's just not BYU's game. We like to systematically wear down a defense with our short to mid-range passing game and mix that up with a little bruising RB play to chew up clock. Nevertheless, McKay's speed isn't really in question. He's got enough to burn as is and will only continue to increase it as the months go by.