@UNLV

FurriousCougar wrote:

CDH wrote:
You can't win em all! It sucks to get rolled that way but thats a tough place to play. Ya I don't get fans calling players out or bashing them when their team is 22-3! I could see if we were a bad team this year but its just shows how spoiled BYU fans have gotten over the last 5 years with BB and FB! IMO

I see your point, but let's be honest here for second. You can't tell me when a player say Max Hall fumbles 6 times in a game against a rival that you weren't blaming or calling him out. Pretty safe bet the coaches were too, so I don't see any reason why fans can't either.

No, I think you're missing the point a bit, that's all. The point is not that you can't say, "hey BYU did not play great tonight and UNLV played really well." The point is that it seems a bit ridiculous to throw the whole season and team under the bus because of one bad game (which I'm going to argue was not even that bad in comparison to how other "top" teams play on the road against opponents not even as good as UNLV).



There's a difference between saying that we had a bad game, and overreacting and saying that our whole team and season sucks and that we have no chance of winning a tournament game this year.

Never threw the whole season under the bus, and didn't really throw the team under the bus either, unless you call pointing out our weak areas throwing a team under the bus. If you saw my earlier post, rather than focus and attribute the outcome of the game to things that BYU couldn't control (refs and UNLV having the game of their lives) I opt to look at the things BYU can control. BYU needs to show up prepped that the opposing team will have the game of their life against them. BYU is/was top dog, so teams are gunning for them. Teams love to beat BYU. Instead, BYU came out as if they were playing TCU. They played the entire game with their backs to the wall and that's a scenario BYU NEVER plays well in.



I want the team to win. I cheer for them all the time and never pick them to lose, unlike others on here (look at the UNM predictions). I'm dropping hundreds of dollars to go see the UNM game on the 27th, so I'm hardly throwing the season out the door. I haven't said anything about writing the team off. All I've said is Rose stinks at establishing an inside game and if the UNLV game is any indication of whether this team will be able to throw the NCAA tourney one-and-done monkey off their backs then we're in trouble.



You can write this off as just a loss or I can look at it as potential of things to come. Regardless, my hope is Rose and company just don't walk away and pat themselves on their back as their coach tells them how proud he is of the way they played and the way they battled like we hear from other coaches. Take the loss and learn from it and nothing is going to be learned if you dismiss the loss to factors you can't control.

Gunk wrote:

Gunk wrote:

You can't win em all! It sucks to get rolled that way but thats a tough place to play. Ya I don't get fans calling players out or bashing them when their team is 22-3! I could see if we were a bad team this year but its just shows how spoiled BYU fans have gotten over the last 5 years with BB and FB! IMO

I see your point, but let's be honest here for second. You can't tell me when a player say Max Hall fumbles 6 times in a game against a rival that you weren't blaming or calling him out. Pretty safe bet the coaches were too, so I don't see any reason why fans can't either.

No, I think you're missing the point a bit, that's all. The point is not that you can't say, "hey BYU did not play great tonight and UNLV played really well." The point is that it seems a bit ridiculous to throw the whole season and team under the bus because of one bad game (which I'm going to argue was not even that bad in comparison to how other "top" teams play on the road against opponents not even as good as UNLV).



There's a difference between saying that we had a bad game, and overreacting and saying that our whole team and season sucks and that we have no chance of winning a tournament game this year.

Never threw the whole season under the bus, and didn't really throw the team under the bus either, unless you call pointing out our weak areas throwing a team under the bus. If you saw my earlier post, rather than focus and attribute the outcome of the game to things that BYU couldn't control (refs and UNLV having the game of their lives) I opt to look at the things BYU can control. BYU needs to show up prepped that the opposing team will have the game of their life against them. BYU is/was top dog, so teams are gunning for them. Teams love to beat BYU. Instead, BYU came out as if they were playing TCU. They played the entire game with their backs to the wall and that's a scenario BYU NEVER plays well in.



I want the team to win. I cheer for them all the time and never pick them to lose, unlike others on here (look at the UNM predictions). I'm dropping hundreds of dollars to go see the UNM game on the 27th, so I'm hardly throwing the season out the door. I haven't said anything about writing the team off. All I've said is Rose stinks at establishing an inside game and if the UNLV game is any indication of whether this team will be able to throw the NCAA tourney one-and-done monkey off their backs then we're in trouble.



You can write this off as just a loss or I can look at it as potential of things to come. Regardless, my hope is Rose and company just don't walk away and pat themselves on their back as their coach tells them how proud he is of the way they played and the way they battled like we hear from other coaches. Take the loss and learn from it and nothing is going to be learned if you dismiss the loss to factors you can't control.

Haha, I'm not referring to you directly as throwing the team or season under the bus, just pointing out what others have done and clarifying CDH's point.

This thread is a bit funny. the team looses it's 3rd of the season and some here read like they need to be on suicide watch.



Call it a bad game and move on!



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ABYUFAN wrote:
This thread is a bit funny. the team looses it's 3rd of the season and some here read like they need to be on suicide watch.



Call it a bad game and move on!



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LEAVE ME ALONE!!!!! I'm trying to cope here. :gross: :gross: 8)

NM and UNLV are respectable teams, but great teams beat good teams on the road. BYU is not a great team, but a good team. Eerily paralleling the BYU FBall image - which is beating the average and decent teams, but not winning the high profile, really tough, important games. ie. NCAA tourney.



On a brighter note, I'm confident BYU wins the conference title (again) and makes it into the 2nd round.



I was really hoping BYU and NM would win out until their showdown in Provo on 2/27. Both teams would have been top 10 by then and 'college gameday' just might be forced to attend.

Gunk wrote:

You can't win em all! It sucks to get rolled that way but thats a tough place to play. Ya I don't get fans calling players out or bashing them when their team is 22-3! I could see if we were a bad team this year but its just shows how spoiled BYU fans have gotten over the last 5 years with BB and FB! IMO

I see your point, but let's be honest here for second. You can't tell me when a player say Max Hall fumbles 6 times in a game against a rival that you weren't blaming or calling him out. Pretty safe bet the coaches were too, so I don't see any reason why fans can't either.

Calling them out, saying they had a bad game is one thing. Calling them talentless scum that shouldn't be playing beyond HS, and that this team (22-3) isn't good enough to play with "the big boys" is another. I know, I know, I paraphrased, but that's pretty much what I've been reading on this and other threads. Good greif, support your team. BE A FAN, not a troll. (rant not directed to you in particular, but to all the global -end of the world comments that are being made)

bigbluepuma wrote:

CDH wrote:
You can't win em all! It sucks to get rolled that way but thats a tough place to play. Ya I don't get fans calling players out or bashing them when their team is 22-3! I could see if we were a bad team this year but its just shows how spoiled BYU fans have gotten over the last 5 years with BB and FB! IMO

I see your point, but let's be honest here for second. You can't tell me when a player say Max Hall fumbles 6 times in a game against a rival that you weren't blaming or calling him out. Pretty safe bet the coaches were too, so I don't see any reason why fans can't either.

Calling them out, saying they had a bad game is one thing. Calling them talentless scum that shouldn't be playing beyond HS, and that this team (22-3) isn't good enough to play with "the big boys" is another. I know, I know, I paraphrased, but that's pretty much what I've been reading on this and other threads. Good greif, support your team. BE A FAN, not a troll. (rant not directed to you in particular, but to all the global -end of the world comments that are being made)

I'd like to see a list of which posters you have in mind when you say our fans are acting like trolls and throwing the team under the bus. I think you'd be surprised by how few people are really on that list. (1-2?)

bluebrotha wrote:
NM and UNLV are respectable teams, but great teams beat good teams on the road. BYU is not a great team, but a good team.

But even great teams don't beat EVERY good team they play on the road, which seems to be the level of expectation some fans and media are heaping on BYU. Look how many top 25 teams lost this week on the road. Some to good teams, some to great teams, some to poor teams. There's a reason it's been 20 years since a team went undefeated in college basketball. It's tough to win on the road. Some times you just run into a buzz saw.



I do think current performance should be weighed more heavily than previous (i.e. the loss to UNLV and UNM should carry more weight than the wins over Nevada and Arizona). And for whatever reason, recently BYU is, I don't want to call it struggling, but they aren't playing as well. They haven't shot better than 48% from the floor in seven games. So they clearly have things they have to improve upon.



But I also don't think the most current game should carry all the weight in the world, which again seems to be what some want it to do.



BYU is a good team, but clearly have played better and if they want to make a run into the tournament, they need to find away to play like they were in December and early January.

kitic77 wrote:

NM and UNLV are respectable teams, but great teams beat good teams on the road. BYU is not a great team, but a good team.

But even great teams don't beat EVERY good team they play on the road, which seems to be the level of expectation some fans and media are heaping on BYU. Look how many top 25 teams lost this week on the road. Some to good teams, some to great teams, some to poor teams. There's a reason it's been 20 years since a team went undefeated in college basketball. It's tough to win on the road. Some times you just run into a buzz saw.



I do think current performance should be weighed more heavily than previous (i.e. the loss to UNLV and UNM should carry more weight than the wins over Nevada and Arizona). And for whatever reason, recently BYU is, I don't want to call it struggling, but they aren't playing as well. They haven't shot better than 48% from the floor in seven games. So they clearly have things they have to improve upon.



But I also don't think the most current game should carry all the weight in the world, which again seems to be what some want it to do.



BYU is a good team, but clearly have played better and if they want to make a run into the tournament, they need to find away to play like they were in December and early January.

I agree with your whole post. I'm not in the camp that expects BYU to win every game, especially on the road against Quality opponents like UNLV.



The only reason I'm disappointed in yesterday's loss is the attitude I saw from BYU to start that game. Instead of coming out and doing whatever they had to, it looked like they were expecting a game from a jr. high team. When they finally turned up their intensity it was way too late. That's all. Still love the team. Still expecting great things. Know they are a lot better than they showed yesterday. And I realize that UNLV had the game of their life, something BYU should have expected.

declocoug wrote:

Gunk wrote:

You can't win em all! It sucks to get rolled that way but thats a tough place to play. Ya I don't get fans calling players out or bashing them when their team is 22-3! I could see if we were a bad team this year but its just shows how spoiled BYU fans have gotten over the last 5 years with BB and FB! IMO

I see your point, but let's be honest here for second. You can't tell me when a player say Max Hall fumbles 6 times in a game against a rival that you weren't blaming or calling him out. Pretty safe bet the coaches were too, so I don't see any reason why fans can't either.

Calling them out, saying they had a bad game is one thing. Calling them talentless scum that shouldn't be playing beyond HS, and that this team (22-3) isn't good enough to play with "the big boys" is another. I know, I know, I paraphrased, but that's pretty much what I've been reading on this and other threads. Good greif, support your team. BE A FAN, not a troll. (rant not directed to you in particular, but to all the global -end of the world comments that are being made)

I'd like to see a list of which posters you have in mind when you say our fans are acting like trolls and throwing the team under the bus. I think you'd be surprised by how few people are really on that list. (1-2?)

I know (I think 3-4), but one fan acting like that is too many, and I had just read through and responded on two other strings where the acid was much stronger. I was, and am, very frustrated with that kind of fanship. I believe that our place as fans is to support and build up our team, not tear them down and throw them under the bus, which is exactly what one in particular, and some supporters, have done. We have the right to voice our displeasure when they don't perform well, but remember that they are just people, and will not always be at their best. It amazes me how much more some of our fans know than our very well trained, very experienced and very successful coaching staff knows (in both basketball and football).

declocoug wrote:
I agree with your whole post. I'm not in the camp that expects BYU to win every game, especially on the road against Quality opponents like UNLV.



The only reason I'm disappointed in yesterday's loss is the attitude I saw from BYU to start that game. Instead of coming out and doing whatever they had to, it looked like they were expecting a game from a jr. high team. When they finally turned up their intensity it was way too late. That's all. Still love the team. Still expecting great things. Know they are a lot better than they showed yesterday. And I realize that UNLV had the game of their life, something BYU should have expected.

Agreed. That's what bothered me too. I was very surprised that BYU came out so flat. It's one thing for UNLV to come out on fire, but BYU's troubles really weren't UNLV driven. It wasn't like we were turning the ball over like crazy leading to fast breaks and open shots.



If BYU had come out and hit some of their open shots - and they were getting some - BYU wouldn't have gotten down so big so early. BYU's mental approach was lacking.

[quote="declocoug



The only reason I'm disappointed in yesterday's loss is the attitude I saw from BYU to start that game. Instead of coming out and doing whatever they had to, it looked like they were expecting a game from a jr. high team. When they finally turned up their intensity it was way too late. That's all. Still love the team. Still expecting great things. Know they are a lot better than they showed yesterday. And I realize that UNLV had the game of their life, something BYU should have expected.[/quote]



Yes they should have, but what they couldn't be expected to foresee was the lights out shooting from all the usually non-three point shooters. I doubt they'll overlook that again.

declocoug wrote:



The only reason I'm disappointed in yesterday's loss is the attitude I saw from BYU to start that game. Instead of coming out and doing whatever they had to, it looked like they were expecting a game from a jr. high team. When they finally turned up their intensity it was way too late. That's all. Still love the team. Still expecting great things. Know they are a lot better than they showed yesterday. And I realize that UNLV had the game of their life, something BYU should have expected.

bigbluepuma wrote:
Yes they should have, but what they couldn't be expected to foresee was the lights out shooting from all the usually non-three point shooters. I doubt they'll overlook that again.

Lesson learned (hopefully)- Everyone will shoot better against BYU. Sometimes it is impossible to tell who is going to go off. We've seen it before unfortunately.



Examples-

Texas A&M

McNamara

UNLV

I totally agree. Yesterdays game was a fluke loss for BYU. How often does a team shoot over 52%? And UNLV was getting huge numbers from guys that don't usually shoot that well.

Oscar Bellfield shot 3-4 from three yesterday, 75%.

On the season he is a 36% shooter from beyond the arc.

Te'Von Willis shot 4-7 from 3 yesterday, 57%.

On the season he is 29% from beyond the arc.



I'm not saying that BYU couldn't have played better but it is really hard to beat a team that is shooting lights out I don't care who you are.

UNLV could've beaten Kansas yesterday they way they were shooting.



This is why I am not taking this loss as hard as many other people. 8)

CannonCougar85 wrote:
I totally agree. Yesterdays game was a fluke loss for BYU. How often does a team shoot over 52%? And UNLV was getting huge numbers from guys that don't usually shoot that well.

Oscar Bellfield shot 3-4 from three yesterday, 75%.

On the season he is a 36% shooter from beyond the arc.

Te'Von Willis shot 4-7 from 3 yesterday, 57%.

On the season he is 29% from beyond the arc.



I'm not saying that BYU couldn't have played better but it is really hard to beat a team that is shooting lights out I don't care who you are.

UNLV could've beaten Kansas yesterday they way they were shooting.



This is why I am not taking this loss as hard as many other people. 8)

We'll see what kind of mood your in if the colts lose. ;)



Go Colts!!!

declocoug wrote:

I totally agree. Yesterdays game was a fluke loss for BYU. How often does a team shoot over 52%? And UNLV was getting huge numbers from guys that don't usually shoot that well.

Oscar Bellfield shot 3-4 from three yesterday, 75%.

On the season he is a 36% shooter from beyond the arc.

Te'Von Willis shot 4-7 from 3 yesterday, 57%.

On the season he is 29% from beyond the arc.



I'm not saying that BYU couldn't have played better but it is really hard to beat a team that is shooting lights out I don't care who you are.

UNLV could've beaten Kansas yesterday they way they were shooting.



This is why I am not taking this loss as hard as many other people. 8)

We'll see what kind of mood your in if the colts lose. ;)



Go Colts!!!

Don't even say it!!! :crazy:



The reason I'm on here is because I'm going stir crazy waiting for the game to start. Still another hour... :sulk:

It's something about playing in Vegas, there's this stigma attached to it because we have historically done so poorly there (much like the Jazz @ San Antonio until this year). We've got to get that monkey off our backs and beat UNLV in the Vegas Open at the end of the season.

I roomed with Dave Hindley while at BYU. He was an all american distance runner for the Y. One time he told me he was not peaking for mid season races but for the end of the season more important ones. That is my concerne with this basketball team and I agree with some who've made similar statements. We've had an excellent season so far but have we peaked too soon? There can be more than one peak so I'm hoping they will peak again when it counts. losses now will be forgotten if we get past the first round of the ncaa tournament.