Unpopular Opinion

Pope isn’t that good of a coach.



Great recruiter (though we can’t seem to get any shooters), good at developing bigs, but bad at offense and getting his guys ready for games. I’ve never seen a more stagnant offense. The last time I saw an offense this stagnant was watching Air Force’s version of the Princeton offense circa 2002. I can understand a poor game or two, but for over half the season the offense looked terrible, even in games that we won.



I have never seen such a complete lack of midrange shots from a team, let alone on a BYU team. No pull up jumpers. No dribble stop and pop. No hand off jumpers off a screen. Few, if any turn-around jumpers. Just a bunch of dribbling around and passing the ball around at the top of the key and wannabe iso plays. What a lot of people don’t realize are players like Jordan, Bryant, and Lebron scored most of their points off jumpers. Haws is the leading scorer at BYU because he ate it up 8 to 15 feet from the basket, jumper after jumper, night after night. We need a guy or two like that to curl off a screen hard, pull up and drain it. Barcello, Lucas, Johnson and Knell came off screens and did nothing. They literally stop and dribble around. If there is empty space, instead of pulling up right there and taking advantage of the wide open space, they proceeded to dribble into traffic.



Instead of adjusting the offense and looking for ways to improve it, Pope continued to do it all season long, crossing our fingers that it would work this game.



Now, before you say…oh the injuries…the injuries are why we lost, this team was playing better in the middle of the season than it was at the end, and Traore developed into a much better big man than Harward and Baxter ever were. So I don’t excuse the poor offense on the injuries. This team digressed and got away from Pope.



We are going to have some long seasons in the Big12. Get used to not going dancing.

Hopefully they do better next year. Wonder who we will get in the transfer portal.

BYU seems to have taken a step back from the prime Rose days. BYU wasn't losing to the dregs of the MWC very often, there were a few years here and there but this was a team that looked worse after 20 games. It was odd. Rose had BYU playing in WCC championship or semi final games frequently. A very odd feeling year after all was said and done.

Yeah. Before cancer, Rose was killing it. Had BYU showing up and competing with lesser talent too. That gets forgotten. Pope is bringing in some really athletic players we’ve dreamed of having but can’t seem to do with them what Rose did.



Which just leads me to believe a lot of it is scheming and coaching. Rose’s team had an identity. He had a style. Pope…I am not sure what his style is and I am not sure he even knows.

Could it have anything to do with revamping your team every year, and doing so mid stream this year? In Rose’s best stretch, key players stayed 4 plus years (Jimmer, Emery, Tavernari, both Haws, Hartsock, Miles, etc.). I’m willing to give Pope the benefit of the doubt this season.

GAKunkel wrote:

Yeah. Before cancer, Rose was killing it. Had BYU showing up and competing with lesser talent too. That gets forgotten. Pope is bringing in some really athletic players we’ve dreamed of having but can’t seem to do with them what Rose did.

You're mistaken when with the sentence, "Before cancer, Rose was killing it."



Rose's teams often underperformed against any team not named Gonzaga. I would say that with Jimmer and before Jimmer, Rose was killing it. Our post-Jimmer years in the WCC were filled with underperformance, frustration, and poor defense.



For example, from 2012 to 2019, Rose-coached teams lost to the follwoing WCC teams not named St. Mary's or Gonzaga and none whom made the NCAA and, I don't believe, the NIT (defensive rating out of approximately 340 teams is in parenthesis):



2012: LMU (24)

2013: SD (twice), SFU (119)

2014 LMU, Pep, Port, Pac (156)

2015 Pep (twice), SD (188) btw, the season ended with a defensive collapse against Mississippi

2016 Port, Pep, Pac (59)

2017 SD, SC, Pep (69)

2018 Pac, LMU, SD (62)

2019 SFU (twice), SD (249)



I'm not saying that Pope is not without his faults. I actually agree that poor coaching and failure to make adjustments led to a disappointing season. However, present disappointment has led some to wish for years that did not exist except in the mind. Rose's post-Jimmer years were very disappointing (two NIT semifinals being the exception).

Haha, I remember during his first two seasons I saw some worrying signs and people just shot me down and thought Pope was gold. He was gold with Rose's recruits. We very well may have gone to a Final Four in his first season which would have immortalized him and kept anyone from ever thinking he was anything less than perfect for the rest of their lives.



The honeymoon period is over. I think he is a good, but not great coach. Like you, I hate his offense. I liked Roses' up tempo offense even if we lost some games that we shouldn't have. I will say that in general the mid range jumper has just disappeared from basketball. It's all about spreading the floor and hitting deep 3s now it seems like.



This isn't necessary against Pope, but I am really torn on the new trend of anybody who got 1 minute less of playing time than they think they deserved will now run to the transfer portal. In some ways I'm glad for the student athletes because why should they be bound for 4 years when the school can drop their scholarship after any given year? But I really hate this trend of half the team entering the portal and leaving every year now. The rumor from Ben Criddle is that half our team very well may enter the portal this year...I'm not sure what the solution is, perhaps scholarships should be a two year commitment from both the student and the school? In any case, we have to do much better in the portal if this is going to be the trend. I'm immediately not impressed with anyone we bring in that has already bounced around at 2+ other schools. What makes you think they'll do well here and not there? Reminds me of Carlino. We need to be looking for players at bigger schools wanting for paying time or players at smaller schools looking to step it up to a bigger school.

byufan4ever wrote:

I liked Roses' up tempo offense even if we lost some games that we shouldn't have.

A few points to ponder if Rose and not Pope had coached the 2019-2020 team:



1. Yoeli would probably not have returned

2. Toolson would not have returned to BYU

3. Poor defense would have continued and BYU would have continued to lose some games that we shouldn't have.



I agree with the point that the transfer portal is an immediate--but not a good--way to build a program. Incoming freshmen need to know that the University has a four-year committment to making them better both on the court and off.

jadesroom wrote:

I liked Roses' up tempo offense even if we lost some games that we shouldn't have.

A few points to ponder if Rose and not Pope had coached the 2019-2020 team:



1. Yoeli would probably not have returned

2. Toolson would not have returned to BYU

3. Poor defense would have continued and BYU would have continued to lose some games that we shouldn't have.



I agree with the point that the transfer portal is an immediate--but not a good--way to build a program. Incoming freshmen need to know that the University has a four-year committment to making them better both on the court and off.

Points #1 & #2 I totally agree with and have commented as such here. #3 True Rose's teams were not known for their defense. Our defense has seemed better under Pope, but at times this season especially the last 10 games or so it was actually atrocious. Gonzaga is a good team and all that but we allowed them to shoot the highest FG% out of any team any game this season (at least at the time of the game). There were times where our guys acted like they didn't want to defend out to the 3 point line or be within 5 feet of their defender. At the beginning of the season our defensive intensity was amazing at times. Not so much later in the season.



I still want to see a better offense AND a better defense. Both can be switched up every once in a while. Pope was so unwilling to try new things. Come on, my tiny HS team was able to run multiple offenses and defenses every freakin game. If Pope isn't good at the X & Os, then he'd better get an assistant who is.

I agree with both you and the original poster on these major points: The team failed to make adjustments as the year progressed, at times the offense and defense were exceptionally stagnant (BYU should not have lost to Santa Clara and Pacific), the number one reason BYU was not in the NCAA this year was coaching and not injuries, and if Pope doesn't coach better then we better say goodbye to the NCAA.

jadesroom wrote:

I agree with both you and the original poster on these major points: The team failed to make adjustments as the year progressed, at times the offense and defense were exceptionally stagnant (BYU should not have lost to Santa Clara and Pacific), the number one reason BYU was not in the NCAA this year was coaching and not injuries, and if Pope doesn't coach better then we better say goodbye to the NCAA.

I mean, losing two big men starters did hurt a lot. Buuuut, I know I wasn't the only one thinking that our frontcourt looked thin going into the season before the injuries. Harward was supposed to be the focus of the offense and I understand that as he is good in the post and a good passer. However, coming into the season, Baxter had already had 2 season-ending injuries and while he had potential I would never describe him as dominate and a potential focus point for the offense. When those two went down Pope didn't try to change his offense. We had how many guards and we couldn't go up tempo small ball? Very rarely did we call plays specifically for Barcello. If someone is guarding Barcello super tight then there's going to be less help defense, but we didn't take advantage of that either.



There are encouraging signs with Traore and Atiki progressing. Pope seems to be a good recruiter and the players seem to like him. But our guard play sucked. He doesn't know how to coach up guards. And he doesn't know how to adapt an offense or defense. We'd better hope that his positives outweigh his negatives because the competition is about to get a lot tougher. We'll be up against not just better players, but better coaches too.



I'll give Pope next season. But we lose out on the NCAA tournament two years in a row and that's when I start really questioning the coaching and the direction of the program.

I think coach is still learning. Hopefully he gets better.

I too am disappointed with the team this season; and I think that there were significant coaching deficiencies - however I believe that much of Fous' development has to be attributed to position development (i.e. coaching) Someone did something right there.



I believe that BYU was a Harward injury away from the NCAA's.



All that said, I am weary of Popes' over-caffeinated "rah rah" schtick. But that's just a personal preference.

ABYUFAN wrote:

I too am disappointed with the team this season; and I think that there were significant coaching deficiencies - however I believe that much of Fous' development has to be attributed to position development (i.e. coaching) Someone did something right there.



I believe that BYU was a Harward injury away from the NCAA's.



All that said, I am weary of Popes' over-caffeinated "rah rah" schtick. But that's just a personal preference.

I agree that Harward would have made the team better. Fous would have been better playing forward along side of him. With Baxter in the mix BYU would have had one of the best frontlines in college.



As for Pope it seemed to me that he and the team were doing well to about mid season and then they just went flat. That could be, in part, to Baxter going out again, but I don't think that's all. I hope Coach Pope gets his act together in time for next season.

If Burgess leaves, I hope we get an assistant that can coach guards.



As others have said, we miss the tourney next year and Pope will start feeling the pressure. He’ll get a bi his first season in the Big 12. After that, if we aren’t dancing I suspect we’ll see a change. Course, one good season in the Big 12 and Pope likely moves to a bigger school.



I am skeptical of Pope and the next season. I’m not a fan of these patch work teams.

Burgess is off to Utah. I hate to see him go.

GAKunkel wrote:

If Burgess leaves, I hope we get an assistant that can coach guards.



As others have said, we miss the tourney next year and Pope will start feeling the pressure. He’ll get a bi his first season in the Big 12. After that, if we aren’t dancing I suspect we’ll see a change. Course, one good season in the Big 12 and Pope likely moves to a bigger school.



I am skeptical of Pope and the next season. I’m not a fan of these patch work teams.

Agree. We gotta get someone who can coach guards. We know Pope can coach the bigs. I know Burgess has ties to the U, but he left for the same position he had here. Maybe he got more money. Hopefully the new coach here can infuse some new ideas because things really got stale midway through this season.

scott715 wrote:

Burgess is off to Utah. I hate to see him go.

Good riddance. He's never been a BYU guy - he used BYU to get to a better coaching job. I'm happy that he's gone

Dave Rice is available. Maybe he will come back I don't expect Madsen to take a step down.

Barret Peery or Eric Daniels are the most logical choices.



Madsen would be a super hire; but as mentioned, he's already a head coach.