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BYU vs BYUh Gamethread

by Cougs_Rule · 11/6/2010

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craigoscarson
YBrit wrote:
Also utah barely beat Adams State College by 10, and gave up 74 points... HA


It wasn't long ago that Utah lost to a NAIA Southwest Baptist team that had won exactly zero games the previous season.



I think BYU-H really came to win tonight. They were just too small and had zero depth. It was a nice test from a nationally ranked DII team. It's not unheard of for a DII team to actually take few games during the regular season; given that fact, a 30 point win doesn't seem that bad (unless you saw the game and noticed all the turnovers and fouls)
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Cougs_Rule
KC can see the floor so well. I dont know what his outside shot looks like. From what others have said he doesnt need it and its not his strength. But this kid reminds me (the white< smaller version) of the way Magic played. He can make a play and draw defenses and make others better around him.

Charles is good Craig. It would be really nice to start to see him really get in the middle of things. I'm still holding my theory that he should come off the bench and take over games. BUt he has earned his PT.

So either KC or Charles coming off the bench will be really solid.

CC did look much better in H2.

Noah seems stronger underneath over last year.
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Cougs_Rule
craigoscarson wrote:
Also utah barely beat Adams State College by 10, and gave up 74 points... HA


It wasn't long ago that Utah lost to a NAIA Southwest Baptist team that had won exactly zero games the previous season.



I think BYU-H really came to win tonight. They were just too small and had zero depth. It was a nice test from a nationally ranked DII team. It's not unheard of for a DII team to actually take few games during the regular season; given that fact, a 30 point win doesn't seem that bad (unless you saw the game and noticed all the turnovers and fouls)


AND I have to believe that Wardenberg helped prepare byuh considerably over say a Laval.
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craigoscarson
dmcougar wrote:
YBrit wrote:
Also utah barely beat Adams State College by 10, and gave up 74 points... HA


It wasn't long ago that Utah lost to a NAIA Southwest Baptist team that had won exactly zero games the previous season.



I think BYU-H really came to win tonight. They were just too small and had zero depth. It was a nice test from a nationally ranked DII team. It's not unheard of for a DII team to actually take few games during the regular season; given that fact, a 30 point win doesn't seem that bad (unless you saw the game and noticed all the turnovers and fouls)


AND I have to believe that Wardenberg helped prepare byuh considerably over say a Laval.


for sure, wardenberg knew to tell his guards not to give up the right to left crossover and to crowd jimmer when he drives.



byuh lucked out with rose giving jackson the night off. our best defender would have cleaned up against those guards.
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Gunk
dmcougar wrote:
KC can see the floor so well. I dont know what his outside shot looks like. From what others have said he doesnt need it and its not his strength. But this kid reminds me (the white< smaller version) of the way Magic played. He can make a play and draw defenses and make others better around him.

Charles is good Craig. It would be really nice to start to see him really get in the middle of things. I'm still holding my theory that he should come off the bench and take over games. BUt he has earned his PT.

So either KC or Charles coming off the bench will be really solid.

CC did look much better in H2.

Noah seems stronger underneath over last year.


Come off the bench? :skeptic:



Depending on who you talk to he's our best defender. He's one of our best rebounders. He shot the ball great tonight. One of, if not the the most physical players on the team and you think he should come off the bench? :skeptic:



Charles needs to be in the starting line-up. I'd rather have Davies come off the bench than Charles.
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craigoscarson
Charles needs to start and get involved in games early to keep his confidence up.



Davies looks to be the weak link in our starting 5. He had more fouls and turnovers than rebounds against a team whos top rebounder (11) is 6'5" (unacceptanle)... Brandon needs to step it up or we're going to lose some close games this year.
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Gunk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcThhWDAy_4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



This highlight is kind of funny. Jimmer misses a layup that eventually bounces around and makes it into Little Collinsworth's hands. Jimmer is practically wide open calling for the ball on the base line. Little Collinsworth is wide open at the 3 pt line.



What's Little Collinsworth do? Drives right into traffic. He had a good 10 ft between him and his defender where he could have pulled it up for a jump shot. Instead he drives into 3 defenders and gets charged with a foul while Jimmer stands there calling for the ball.



I like Little Collinsworth's tenacity, but I saw him tonight pass up wide-open mid-range shots several times in favor of trying to take it to the hole. That's what I really liked about Haws. Haws had no problem pulling up and knocking down 12 - 15 ft jumper; wasn't out to try and prove anything by taking it to the hole. Best thing Little Collinsworth can do is work on and recognize when he has that mid-range jumper.
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Gunk
craigoscarson wrote:
Charles needs to start and get involved in games early to keep his confidence up.



Davies looks to be the weak link in our starting 5. He had more fouls and turnovers than rebounds against a team whos top rebounder (11) is 6'5" (unacceptanle)... Brandon needs to step it up or we're going to lose some close games this year.


Davies looked completely lost out there tonight. If he isn't going to assert himself, I'd rather have Noah and Big Collinsworth on the court at the same time. I'll take a shorter center that plays more physical and makes his presence felt any day over a taller pastie.
I
Italics
Gunk wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcThhWDAy_4




That is indeed a funny highlight.



Charles looks like he's gonna seriously murder somebody after the foul is called, Noah looks completely shocked and let down, and Jimmer goes over to help little C up until he sees that a foul is called - then he just turns around to jog back down court. :lol:
M
Mars


Is Davies losing his job to CC?



Will KC eventually take Abouo's starting spot?
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YBrit
Mars wrote:


Is Davies losing his job to CC?



Will KC eventually take Abouo's starting spot?




Probably to Davies, but not Abouo.
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Gunk
YBrit wrote:


Is Davies losing his job to CC?



Will KC eventually take Abouo's starting spot?




Probably to Davies, but not Abouo.


I like the idea of Noah and CC out on the court at the same time, which is too bad. I had high hopes for Davies. Maybe he'll step it up.



I think starting KC over Abouo would be a huge mistake, both defensively and offensively.
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craigoscarson
Gunk wrote:
Mars wrote:


Is Davies losing his job to CC?



Will KC eventually take Abouo's starting spot?




Probably to Davies, but not Abouo.


I like the idea of Noah and CC out on the court at the same time, which is too bad. I had high hopes for Davies. Maybe he'll step it up.



I think starting KC over Abouo would be a huge mistake, both defensively and offensively.


KC needs to have the ball in his hand to be really effective, Abouo doesn't. I think we're going to see KC leading the point with the 2nd team and only occasionally seeing KC at the 2-3 when fouls, injury, etc. dictate. He's tremendous at getting the team up the court on the break and he can't do a ton of that if Jimmer is the one leading it. Abouo is the finisher and could likely be just as effective with Jimmer or KC leading the break.



Martineau wasn't particularly effective this week but showed major flashes in the blue white game. I dont' mind him as a third option at the point and considering the timing, we'll need Martineau to get up to speed for 2011-12.
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Mars
craigoscarson wrote:
YBrit wrote:
Probably to Davies, but not Abouo.
I like the idea of Noah and CC out on the court at the same time, which is too bad. I had high hopes for Davies. Maybe he'll step it up. I think starting KC over Abouo would be a huge mistake, both defensively and offensively.
KC needs to have the ball in his hand to be really effective, Abouo doesn't. I think we're going to see KC leading the point with the 2nd team and only occasionally seeing KC at the 2-3 when fouls, injury, etc. dictate. He's tremendous at getting the team up the court on the break and he can't do a ton of that if Jimmer is the one leading it. Abouo is the finisher and could likely be just as effective with Jimmer or KC leading the break. Martineau wasn't particularly effective this week but showed major flashes in the blue white game. I dont' mind him as a third option at the point and considering the timing, we'll need Martineau to get up to speed for 2011-12.
You know, I like what all 3 of you said here.



I like Davies, but CC has shown a lot so far. He plays hard and has good potential. And I like how Abouo has started this season, but I also like both Collinsworth brothers being on the floor at the same time.



KC playing back-up PG makes a lot of sense. That allows Winder to blueshirt this year, which makes sense.





On a side note, I'm also surprised -and pleased- with Zylstra's play so far this season.
Q
Qman
I only got to see a part of the game, but I was hearten to see a few things



-Chris Collinsworth carries his new weight well and he moved well. He looked like he was pressing too much. But with some time he will be able to help a lot



-Martineau looked very quick and he has the ability to pressure ballhandlers.



-Abouo looked ready for big time minutes. His spot-up jumper was on and he played his normal defense.



-Hartsock looked like he was just getting off a injury- He was step slow and he looked like he didn't have his normal lift



-Jimmer was just coasting



-Kyle Collinsworth is bigger and stronger than I expected. He appears to not believe in shooting open jumpers.



-Zylstra was a surprise. He could be available role player with his size and spot-up shooting ability.



-Davies looked fairly poor.
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Lawboy
It appears that the real weakness on the BYU staff is developing the bigs. Just a fact and we all have noticed it for a few years. Davies needs to improve this year, CC needs to be better than pre-mish, and so does Hartsock. If the 4-5 guys can be solid, BYU is top 10. If not, we lose more games than this team should. But the fact is, the low post play was average at best.
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mizzoucoug
Lawboy wrote:
It appears that the real weakness on the BYU staff is developing the bigs. Just a fact and we all have noticed it for a few years. Davies needs to improve this year, CC needs to be better than pre-mish, and so does Hartsock. If the 4-5 guys can be solid, BYU is top 10. If not, we lose more games than this team should. But the fact is, the low post play was average at best.




Arg! I guess it's more of the same for us--live and die by the 3. Although if Charles gets more playing time that bumps up our defense a notch, which is also what kills us against top teams. We can't get stops or boards when we play UNM, SDSU, and tourney teams because they're usually longer and better jumpers. I felt last year that Abouo should've been out there more against those teams because he is the lone physical paint defender that we have. Rose must see this and give Charles extra minutes in these games.
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Cougs_Rule
While I would tend to agree that KC probably should run the 2nd team as a point.I would be very intrigued with KC as point and Jimmer at 2. KC has the potential to be a better distributer than Jimmer. jimmer will penetrate, but he is usually going hard and trying to draw the foul. KC is more likely to distribute. As a result, I think Davies would do better with KC at the point: dribble, drive and dish--though I dont think that is likely to happen with Jackson around. But run a three guard offense sliding Charles to 5 and Noah to 5 or CC and that is a very dynamic offense.

CC has got to find some offense. He is showing some potential for toughness. And yes, CC and NH were in at the same time vs BYUh, but again, their tallest was 6-6; so match=ups were better smaller, faster.
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Mars
dmcougar wrote:
run a three guard offense sliding Charles to 5 and Noah to 5 or CC and that is a very dynamic offense.

Just how tall do you think Charles is? ;)
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Gunk
Mars wrote:
run a three guard offense sliding Charles to 5 and Noah to 5 or CC and that is a very dynamic offense.

Just how tall do you think Charles is? ;)


What he lacks in height, he'll make up in heart. :D
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