how does your home town measure up?

As long as gas does not get too expensive. In my small town work is a 5 minute drive or I could walk it in 20 minutes.

So, you want to take a bedroom community of 2,000 people that is largely populated by professionals with some graduate work who have fled the rest of Jersey to try and live away from the rest of Jersey and use that one isolated outlier to try and dispel a view of the state as a whole? You want us to look at one promising sapling in the armpit forest that is New Jersey and re-evaluate?



The only thing Jersey has going for it is the Pine Barrens (and maybe Hopewell), but only because there's not many actual New Jerseyans there to foul it up like the rest of the state.

My time spent in Princeton was very nice. I thought that area was very nice. But the blight on the earth that is Newark can never be forgiven.

Schmoe wrote:
I don't know, either, off the top of my head. I don't think I'd be too far off in assuming that most towns of under 2000 residents have lower crime statistics and higher "walkability" etc. than the larger cities in their states.

I think that has something to do with it, but compared to small Utah towns (at least the ones I looked up), it's really not even close.



For example, Helper Utah has about 2000 residents, but has way more crime (191 on average) schools not on par (6 and 6) and its not very walkable (40 out of 100).



Hyrum Utah has slightly better schools but is less walkable (32). It doesn't have a crime rating but has 9 registered sex offenders, which is a higher ratio than Camden NJ and just slightly less than Newark.



There are probably better small towns in Utah than these, but those were the first two I looked up.

ABYUFAN wrote:
I'm a bit sympathetic to the OP, the eye roll with "Fresno, CA" has to be on par with New Jersey, but "walkability" doesn't really mean anything to me, I have 4 cars for a reason, I'd rather not be in walking distance to everything, I like living one to 3 miles away, but that's just me.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

My wife was more into the being able to walk than was I, but have to admit there some nice advantages like actually getting to know your neighbors. When we had our 3rd kid (just 2 years after moving here) we were brought around 25 meals, 23 of which came from non member neighbors and friends.

snoscythe wrote:
So, you want to take a bedroom community of 2,000 people that is largely populated by professionals with some graduate work who have fled the rest of Jersey to try and live away from the rest of Jersey and use that one isolated outlier to try and dispel a view of the state as a whole? You want us to look at one promising sapling in the armpit forest that is New Jersey and re-evaluate?



The only thing Jersey has going for it is the Pine Barrens (and maybe Hopewell), but only because there's not many actual New Jerseyans there to foul it up like the rest of the state.

See, this is the ignorance I'm talking about. As actual New Jerseyans are wealthier and better educated than 90% of the other states (including Utah), Hopewell is actually more of the rule than the exception.

Larrycoug wrote:

I'm a bit sympathetic to the OP, the eye roll with "Fresno, CA" has to be on par with New Jersey, but "walkability" doesn't really mean anything to me, I have 4 cars for a reason, I'd rather not be in walking distance to everything, I like living one to 3 miles away, but that's just me.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

My wife was more into the being able to walk than was I, but have to admit there some nice advantages like actually getting to know your neighbors. When we had our 3rd kid (just 2 years after moving here) we were brought around 25 meals, 23 of which came from non member neighbors and friends.

Neighbors and walkability are two different things. We have lots of nice neighbors, our kids grew up playng on the front yards along the street with many other boys their age, it is great having neighbors real close, but being able to walk to the grocery store means nothing to me, I'm driving there 10 out of 10 times

snoscythe wrote:
You want us to look at one promising sapling in the armpit forest that is New Jersey and re-evaluate?



The only thing Jersey has going for it is the Pine Barrens (and maybe Hopewell), but only because there's not many actual New Jerseyans there to foul it up like the rest of the state.

Sno, I wonder what your experience with NJ was? You obviously have some strong feelings that have caused some pretty sweeping generalizations. Did you get mugged in Newark or something?

scott715 wrote:
don;t you remember the Pace Picante Sauce commerical where they read the label that said made in NJ.

For the record, I got this one.



;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTX6ulE_Du8



A classic.

So guess which state is much less corrupt than Utah? Yep, NJ.



http://www.iwatchnews.org/2012/03/19/8423/grading-nation-how-accountable-your-state" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Larrycoug wrote:

So, you want to take a bedroom community of 2,000 people that is largely populated by professionals with some graduate work who have fled the rest of Jersey to try and live away from the rest of Jersey and use that one isolated outlier to try and dispel a view of the state as a whole? You want us to look at one promising sapling in the armpit forest that is New Jersey and re-evaluate?



The only thing Jersey has going for it is the Pine Barrens (and maybe Hopewell), but only because there's not many actual New Jerseyans there to foul it up like the rest of the state.

See, this is the ignorance I'm talking about. As actual New Jerseyans are wealthier and better educated than 90% of the other states (including Utah), Hopewell is actually more of the rule than the exception.

What no response Sno? Does someone's ego not permit them to admit when they are wrong (just curious as you've been strangely silent on the Wong matter as well)?

Just have to say, NJ has some beautiful country and communities. But I'm in Philly so I guess it's all relative. :)

Larrycoug wrote:

snoscythe wrote:
So, you want to take a bedroom community of 2,000 people that is largely populated by professionals with some graduate work who have fled the rest of Jersey to try and live away from the rest of Jersey and use that one isolated outlier to try and dispel a view of the state as a whole? You want us to look at one promising sapling in the armpit forest that is New Jersey and re-evaluate?



The only thing Jersey has going for it is the Pine Barrens (and maybe Hopewell), but only because there's not many actual New Jerseyans there to foul it up like the rest of the state.

See, this is the ignorance I'm talking about. As actual New Jerseyans are wealthier and better educated than 90% of the other states (including Utah), Hopewell is actually more of the rule than the exception.

What no response Sno? Does someone's ego not permit them to admit when they are wrong (just curious as you've been strangely silent on the Wong matter as well)?

Larry-I'm only on the site occasionally anymore, so don't let your smugness fool you into thinking you've proven anything. Not that responding to trolls isn't high on my priority list anyways.



All you've done is show that when you cherry-pick statistics you can even make New Jersey look good. Mark Twain has been proven right again.



Why do people in Jersey make more money? Because it has the third highest cost of living in the nation. It's the same reason people in NYC and Hawaii get bigger paychecks than people living in Omaha--because they are paying twice as much for their studio in the city that the guy in Utah pays for his 3 bed 2 bath on a quarter acre.



Here's a good cherry-pick for the other side:



http://www.forbes.com/2009/03/11/united-states-healthy-lifestyle-health-healthy-living.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



And for the record--I don't live in Utah, and I avoid being in Utah more than I have to be. That said, I've been up and down Jersey, and the pockets of splendor don't compensate for the armpits. I'd rather take my kids to Utah and deal with that than subject them to New Jersey.

snoscythe wrote:

Larrycoug wrote:

So, you want to take a bedroom community of 2,000 people that is largely populated by professionals with some graduate work who have fled the rest of Jersey to try and live away from the rest of Jersey and use that one isolated outlier to try and dispel a view of the state as a whole? You want us to look at one promising sapling in the armpit forest that is New Jersey and re-evaluate?



The only thing Jersey has going for it is the Pine Barrens (and maybe Hopewell), but only because there's not many actual New Jerseyans there to foul it up like the rest of the state.

See, this is the ignorance I'm talking about. As actual New Jerseyans are wealthier and better educated than 90% of the other states (including Utah), Hopewell is actually more of the rule than the exception.

What no response Sno? Does someone's ego not permit them to admit when they are wrong (just curious as you've been strangely silent on the Wong matter as well)?

Larry-I'm only on the site occasionally anymore, so don't let your smugness fool you into thinking you've proven anything. Not that responding to trolls isn't high on my priority list anyways.



All you've done is show that when you cherry-pick statistics you can even make New Jersey look good. Mark Twain has been proven right again.



Why do people in Jersey make more money? Because it has the third highest cost of living in the nation. It's the same reason people in NYC and Hawaii get bigger paychecks than people living in Omaha--because they are paying twice as much for their studio in the city that the guy in Utah pays for his 3 bed 2 bath on a quarter acre.



Here's a good cherry-pick for the other side:



http://www.forbes.com/2009/03/11/united-states-healthy-lifestyle-health-healthy-living.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



And for the record--I don't live in Utah, and I avoid being in Utah more than I have to be. That said, I've been up and down Jersey, and the pockets of splendor don't compensate for the armpits. I'd rather take my kids to Utah and deal with that than subject them to New Jersey.

Cherry picking? I used crime stats (from the past 10 years), school rankings (elementary, middle and high school) and a walk-ability score to describe a town. If I'm cherry picking stats to prove unfounded conclusions, as you suggest, there must be a even more stats (the cherry tree if you will) to support the your "proper" conclusion. I challenge you to find them.



Also, what does Twain say about people who make conclusions without support of any facts or stats--which is what you have done with NJ. I know you could cherry pick some NJ statistics from it's rough areas like Newark and Camden to disparage the whole state, but you haven't even done that much.



Also, isn't cost of living driven mostly by wages rather than the other way around? For example, housing prices are high in Manhattan because there are a lot of highly trained, highly paid, professionals wanting to live in there. Utah has a much lower percentage of highly skilled professionals so houses cost less.

I grew up in NJ and loved it. I was on the shore (Red Bank, Sandy Hook, Long Branch). It was a great area and very family friendly and I felt safe. Of course that was 15 years ago, so it's possible it's changed.

declocoug wrote:
Just have to say, NJ has some beautiful country and communities. But I'm in Philly so I guess it's all relative. :)

i love Philly. We're pretty much equal distance from Philly and NYC (45 minutes to Philly, an hour to NYC), but I almost always prefer going to Philly. Also, our neighborhood Pizza joint (owners are family friends) just opened a location near South street--which I highly recommend.



As Dr. Brule would say, check it out.



http://www.nomadpizzaco.com/gallery.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

SpiffCoug wrote:
I grew up in NJ and loved it. I was on the shore (Red Bank, Sandy Hook, Long Branch). It was a great area and very family friendly and I felt safe. Of course that was 15 years ago, so it's possible it's changed.

I'll agree to agree with you on this one Spiff! I hear those place are nice--but haven't been there yet. Lots of places to explore.

Best attraction in Philly is the Franklin Institute.

SpiffCoug wrote:
Best attraction in Philly is the Franklin Institute.

Yep--love the Franklin Institute! We have an annual pass.