Response to “Are Mormons Closer to Muslims or Christians?”

CougarClaw wrote:

A great excuse to kill Jews, but don't worry, this guy only has millions and millions of followers, so it's a really "fringe" group. Just like every other group of Muslims in the world that also believe Jews should be annihilated.



But I have to give you props for being so politically correct.

at no point have I disagreed that many muslims want the jews annihilated. They do. That's bad. I don't need to argue this point since it's pretty common knowledge.



What I do have to argue is the not-so-small detail that the jews are currently annihilating a Muslim nation. They are. Right now.



Islamic anger against the Jews is not completely unjustified. In the video the Saudi refers to Palestine as a kind of concentration camp. Well guess what, the Saudi is right! Palestine has checkpoints. Huge encompassing concrete walls. miles and miles of barbed wire, dogs, jeeps, and watchtowers. Stifling economic crackdowns. 0 foreign trade. blockades, crippling military checkpoints, random imprisonments. police brutality, and the list goes on and on.



Put yourself in their place for even a fraction of a moment and you'd want to "liberate" your brothers in Palestine too. It's an absolute mess. But it's a two-sided mess.

Point of fact. There never has been a palestinian country. These people are pawns of Syria, Jordan, and Iran. Those countries want the people to suffer so they can continue to harp on the US and Isreal. And how can Isreal be "stealing land that has been theirs for thousands of years?

There is a reason for the walls, the wire, dogs etc. its because mulims keep trying to kill Jews, Christians, and every other non-muslim they can! BTW those walls you talk of surround Isreal not palestine. I would like to see the proof on the police brutality etc. As for the video, I think you missed the point. The guy was on there spewing lies to get muslims fired up against Isreal.

BroncoBot wrote:

'Tumour' of Israel will soon be destroyed: Ahmadinejad"



August 17, 2012



Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad told an annual anti-Israel protest in Tehran on Friday that the Jewish state was a "cancerous tumour" that will soon be excised, drawing Western rebukes.



Washington said Ahmadinejad's statements were "reprehensible", while Paris viewed them as "outrageous."



Ahmadinejad's diatribe against Israel in his Quds (Jerusalem) Day address was the latest in a long line to have drawn criticism from Western governments.



"The Zionist regime and the Zionists are a cancerous tumour," he said.



"The nations of the region will soon finish off the usurper Zionists in the Palestinian land.... A new Middle East will definitely be formed. With the grace of God and help of the nations, in the new Middle East there will be no trace of the Americans and Zionists," he said."



http://news.yahoo.com/tumour-israel-soon-destroyed-ahmadinejad-091548418.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't think anyone here agrees with Ahmadinejad. We all know how he feels. But he's not speaking for all of Islam.

Correct - he is not speaking for all Muslims in the entire world. He is speaking for Iran, which will shortly have nuclear weapon capability, and is committed to destroying Israel.



Who is stating Ahmadinejad speaks for the entire Muslim world? Who ever posted that?

CougarClaw wrote:

So I am offended by even the suggestion that His church is even remotely like that of the Muslim religion. And anyone trying to claim tolerance and understanding should go to a street corner in Jordan, holding a bible (or BOM) and preach about God's love. Let's see what happens in the name of "tolerance". Understand that on those "Coexist" bumper stickers the letter C wants to pull a "pac-man" on the rest of them and gobble them all up.



What would you do if you caught your muslim neighbor throwing a BOM in the toilet? What we he do if he caught you doing the same to a Qur'an? How many from your EQ or High Priests Quorem would be trying to burn down his house? But if you did it, not only would he claim offense but there would be riots in Europe, Africa, and Asia, and you would end up in hiding.

I don't even know where to start on this one. Your post is filled with mistrust, hate, and anger. My religion doesn't teach that. How are you so convinced of the evil of 1.6 Billion people? It's all about love my friend. Understanding and love. Right now, doesn't sound like this topic generates much of either for you which means we don't have anything to learn from each other.

Yeah, I suffer from mistrust, hate and anger lol. When you reply please pay a little more attention. I even made sure to point out that I saw a difference between the people and islam “Islam is evil. There are many Muslims that are not evil but the religion they practice is.”

As for learning from each other, no unfortunately you seem to believe that the “radical fringe” does not represent islam. Well, until I see muslims stand up for Isreal and the US then I guess I have to harbour a little of that “mistrust” you mentioned. Just bear in mind that islam teaches that you too are an enemy and eventually need to be either killed, enslaved, or made a dhimmi.

Also feel free to point out the hatred and anger part of it. I only see facts about islam. I guess that means hate.



quinn's 2nd law of liberalism Hate speech is any speech a liberal doesn't agree with.

imuakahuku wrote:



quinn's 2nd law of liberalism Hate speech is any speech a liberal doesn't agree with.

I really riled you up there didn't I. Now you're calling me names. That's okay. I don't hate you. you should try it some time.

Ddawg wrote:

Ddawg wrote:
'Tumour' of Israel will soon be destroyed: Ahmadinejad"



August 17, 2012



Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad told an annual anti-Israel protest in Tehran on Friday that the Jewish state was a "cancerous tumour" that will soon be excised, drawing Western rebukes.



Washington said Ahmadinejad's statements were "reprehensible", while Paris viewed them as "outrageous."



Ahmadinejad's diatribe against Israel in his Quds (Jerusalem) Day address was the latest in a long line to have drawn criticism from Western governments.



"The Zionist regime and the Zionists are a cancerous tumour," he said.



"The nations of the region will soon finish off the usurper Zionists in the Palestinian land.... A new Middle East will definitely be formed. With the grace of God and help of the nations, in the new Middle East there will be no trace of the Americans and Zionists," he said."



http://news.yahoo.com/tumour-israel-soon-destroyed-ahmadinejad-091548418.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't think anyone here agrees with Ahmadinejad. We all know how he feels. But he's not speaking for all of Islam.

Correct - he is not speaking for all Muslims in the entire world. He is speaking for Iran, which will shortly have nuclear weapon capability, and is committed to destroying Israel.



Who is stating Ahmadinejad speaks for the entire Muslim world? Who ever posted that?

So if he's speaking for Iran, why do his statements merit mentioning in this thread? He's just a crazy old dude. I was critical of your post because your using sensationalism to try and prove a point, which is exactly what the MSM is doing.

BroncoBot wrote:

BroncoBot wrote:

'Tumour' of Israel will soon be destroyed: Ahmadinejad"



August 17, 2012



Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad told an annual anti-Israel protest in Tehran on Friday that the Jewish state was a "cancerous tumour" that will soon be excised, drawing Western rebukes.



Washington said Ahmadinejad's statements were "reprehensible", while Paris viewed them as "outrageous."



Ahmadinejad's diatribe against Israel in his Quds (Jerusalem) Day address was the latest in a long line to have drawn criticism from Western governments.



"The Zionist regime and the Zionists are a cancerous tumour," he said.



"The nations of the region will soon finish off the usurper Zionists in the Palestinian land.... A new Middle East will definitely be formed. With the grace of God and help of the nations, in the new Middle East there will be no trace of the Americans and Zionists," he said."



http://news.yahoo.com/tumour-israel-soon-destroyed-ahmadinejad-091548418.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't think anyone here agrees with Ahmadinejad. We all know how he feels. But he's not speaking for all of Islam.

Correct - he is not speaking for all Muslims in the entire world. He is speaking for Iran, which will shortly have nuclear weapon capability, and is committed to destroying Israel.



Who is stating Ahmadinejad speaks for the entire Muslim world? Who ever posted that?

So if he's speaking for Iran, why do his statements merit mentioning in this thread? He's just a crazy old dude. I was critical of your post because your using sensationalism to try and prove a point, which is exactly what the MSM is doing.

Correction - no sensationalism - pure fact.



Correction - not some crazy old dude. The president of a nation (who may be crazy) with nuclear power, soon to have nuclear weapons, a big bank account - and the determination to do very bad things.



Please explain and define - who speaks for the entire Muslim world? Thx.

CougarClaw wrote:

quinn's 2nd law of liberalism Hate speech is any speech a liberal doesn't agree with.

I really riled you up there didn't I. Now you're calling me names. That's okay. I don't hate you. you should try it some time.

Lol Umm who started with the hate speech? are you self identifying? you are excusing Islam, I just pointed out facts, gave my opinion and suddenly I was full of hate. see how it works boys and girls.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

On that note... I think CougarClaw has earned a new nickname.



I dub thee, "The Craw."



Is that name calling? Bonus points for anybody that knows the reference.



(clue: If you are under 40 years old you probably won't have any idea.)

imuakahuku wrote:

imuakahuku wrote:



quinn's 2nd law of liberalism Hate speech is any speech a liberal doesn't agree with.

I really riled you up there didn't I. Now you're calling me names. That's okay. I don't hate you. you should try it some time.

Lol Umm who started with the hate speech? are you self identifying? you are excusing Islam, I just pointed out facts, gave my opinion and suddenly I was full of hate. see how it works boys and girls.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

.. How on this green earth did you finagle hate speech out of my response? self-identifying? LOL. I JUST finished writing "I DON"T HATE YOU."



Let's go back to logic-ville for a moment. My goal was to provide insight into my experience with muslims, living in a muslim country, speaking their language, and knowing them personally. If you feel your understanding of muslims is superior to mine to the point where you can completely disregard my perspectives as you are now doing, then that's your call.



However, if someone came to me and tried to tell me how Mormons were evil based on things he/she had read on the internet I would sincerely hope they would at least consider my real-life experience before calling me a liberal and ignoring cries for tolerance and brotherly love as you are now doing. No need to hate. anyone.

tww wrote:
On that note... I think CougarClaw has earned a new nickname.



I dub thee, "The Craw."



Is that name calling? Bonus points for anybody that knows the reference.



(clue: If you are under 40 years old you probably won't have any idea.)

CRAW. : an itching skin disease produced by the larvae of the filarial worm causing onchocerciasis migrating in the subcutaneous tissues;



gee thanks.

CougarClaw wrote:

On that note... I think CougarClaw has earned a new nickname.



I dub thee, "The Craw."



Is that name calling? Bonus points for anybody that knows the reference.



(clue: If you are under 40 years old you probably won't have any idea.)

CRAW. : an itching skin disease produced by the larvae of the filarial worm causing onchocerciasis migrating in the subcutaneous tissues;



gee thanks.

LOL! That sounds great but..... (buzzzzzzzzzzz.) Sorry, that is not the reference I am looking for. Care to try again? Need another clue. Okay, here is the second clue. If you are Smart you will know the right answer.

Here is another clue: The name is Craw, not CRAW!

Do I get credit for being under 40 but knowing how to use Google to get the answers. http://bojack.org/2005/09/not_craw_craw.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Mythranor wrote:
Do I get credit for being under 40 but knowing how to use Google to get the answers. http://bojack.org/2005/09/not_craw_craw.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner. Good work. But it is still probably not as funny as it would have been had you seen the show.



Ah, the good old days win America was a free-er place and we could poke fun at commies and well, anything anti-American. I just found a little "chaos" in CougarClaw's political argument.



Thus, the Craw.

tww wrote:
Here is another clue: The name is Craw, not CRAW!

Back to the Beach?

CougarClaw wrote:

CougarClaw wrote:

quinn's 2nd law of liberalism Hate speech is any speech a liberal doesn't agree with.

I really riled you up there didn't I. Now you're calling me names. That's okay. I don't hate you. you should try it some time.

Lol Umm who started with the hate speech? are you self identifying? you are excusing Islam, I just pointed out facts, gave my opinion and suddenly I was full of hate. see how it works boys and girls.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

.. How on this green earth did you finagle hate speech out of my response? self-identifying? LOL. I JUST finished writing "I DON"T HATE YOU."



Let's go back to logic-ville for a moment. My goal was to provide insight into my experience with muslims, living in a muslim country, speaking their language, and knowing them personally. If you feel your understanding of muslims is superior to mine to the point where you can completely disregard my perspectives as you are now doing, then that's your call.



However, if someone came to me and tried to tell me how Mormons were evil based on things he/she had read on the internet I would sincerely hope they would at least consider my real-life experience before calling me a liberal and ignoring cries for tolerance and brotherly love as you are now doing. No need to hate. anyone.

Sometimes I think these are circular.

First, you describe my post as full of hate and anger. So I ask you to point it out and you accuse me of claiming that you are full of hate and anger. Then you again accuse me of hate. LOL See the circle?

I didn't call you a liberal because I am pretty sure there are no liberals on this website. Maybe I'll take the time to educate you on what a liberal really is. There seems to be some misconception on this board.

As for islam, thanks for the perspective but please do not say we are like them and can learn good from islam. Islam is Satan's church. There is no clearer way I can put it. There are some good people that are islamic but the religion is evil.



case in point: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/08/20/christian-girl-with-down-syndrome-faces-death-penalty-for-allegedly-burning/?test=latestnews





"A Christian girl with Down syndrome could be punished by death in Pakistan after she was spotted holding burned pages of Islamic text in public, activists and police say.



Defaming Islam, the Koran or the Prophet Muhammed is a capital offense in Pakistan.



After the incident, religious tensions and rallies involving Muslim protesters forced Christians to temporarily flee Mehrabad"



And they are fleeing run of the mill villagers. The story is atrocious. Just like islam's teachings. And my overall point is that you cannot go into any muslim country or even neighborhood in this world and tear a page out of the koran without inciting violence against you. And in the case of the islamic governed countries a death penalty. Heck just try to teach the sermon on the mount on a street corner and watch what happens.

So feel good that some of them are nice but the run of the mill villager sure seems to radicalize quickly and violently in the name of islam.



So to the point of this thread, it is offensive to me to see anyone claim that His church is anything like the muslim church.

imuakahuku wrote:

There seems to be some misconception on this board.



As for islam, thanks for the perspective but please do not say we are like them and can learn good from islam. Islam is Satan's church. There is no clearer way I can put it.



There are some good people that are islamic but the religion is evil.



So to the point of this thread, it is offensive to me to see anyone claim that His church is anything like the muslim church.

Imua,



Here's some reading for you.



http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705385738/LDS-church-gymnasium-open-for-Muslim-worship-services.html?pg=all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2002/03/a-life-among-muslims" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2000/08/a-latter-day-saint-perspective-on-muhammad" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Which includes a great quote by President Gordon B. Hinckley- "Be respectful of the opinions and feelings of other people. Recognize their virtues; don’t look for their faults. Look for their strengths and their virtues, and you will find strength and virtues that will be helpful in your own life."



There's more if you want it. I don't know why the church would go to such effort to reach a hand out to the Muslim community if it is "Satan's church". That's taking it way too far man.

BroncoBot wrote:

There seems to be some misconception on this board.



As for islam, thanks for the perspective but please do not say we are like them and can learn good from islam. Islam is Satan's church. There is no clearer way I can put it.



There are some good people that are islamic but the religion is evil.



So to the point of this thread, it is offensive to me to see anyone claim that His church is anything like the muslim church.

Imua,



Here's some reading for you.



http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705385738/LDS-church-gymnasium-open-for-Muslim-worship-services.html?pg=all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2002/03/a-life-among-muslims" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2000/08/a-latter-day-saint-perspective-on-muhammad" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Which includes a great quote by President Gordon B. Hinckley- "Be respectful of the opinions and feelings of other people. Recognize their virtues; don’t look for their faults. Look for their strengths and their virtues, and you will find strength and virtues that will be helpful in your own life."



There's more if you want it. I don't know why the church would go to such effort to reach a hand out to the Muslim community if it is "Satan's church". That's taking it way too far man.

I am looking for the quote that says it is not Satan's church. Did I miss it?



There seem to be crossing arguments going on in this thread.

One point is that we should be friendly and respectful of Muslims. I am fine with that but it does not negate the other point being made which is the evil intention and disposition of Islam as a whole. We can be friendly and wise at the same time.



Remember, niceness is not the same as goodness. Evil people are nice to you right up until they rob, rape or kill you. Niceness does not mean anything when judging character. Too many people make that mistake. Sometimes it is their last.

tww wrote:

imuakahuku wrote:

There seems to be some misconception on this board.



As for islam, thanks for the perspective but please do not say we are like them and can learn good from islam. Islam is Satan's church. There is no clearer way I can put it.



There are some good people that are islamic but the religion is evil.



So to the point of this thread, it is offensive to me to see anyone claim that His church is anything like the muslim church.

Imua,



Here's some reading for you.



http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705385738/LDS-church-gymnasium-open-for-Muslim-worship-services.html?pg=all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2002/03/a-life-among-muslims" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2000/08/a-latter-day-saint-perspective-on-muhammad" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Which includes a great quote by President Gordon B. Hinckley- "Be respectful of the opinions and feelings of other people. Recognize their virtues; don’t look for their faults. Look for their strengths and their virtues, and you will find strength and virtues that will be helpful in your own life."



There's more if you want it. I don't know why the church would go to such effort to reach a hand out to the Muslim community if it is "Satan's church". That's taking it way too far man.

I am looking for the quote that says it is not Satan's church. Did I miss it?



There seem to be crossing arguments going on in this thread.

One point is that we should be friendly and respectful of Muslims. I am fine with that but it does not negate the other point being made which is the evil intention and disposition of Islam as a whole. We can be friendly and wise at the same time.



Remember, niceness is not the same as goodness. Evil people are nice to you right up until they rob, rape or kill you. Niceness does not mean anything when judging character. Too many people make that mistake. Sometimes it is their last.

Does it have to say it is not Satan's church for you to make the connection? Please find for me, since you used the term, where the LDS church believes in any way shape or form that Islam is the church of the devil. I thought (according to McKonkie) that was the Catholic church?



So you guys really believe "Islam" is evil and fringe radicals are actually practicing Islam?

Is Judaism evil?

Is Catholicism?

Is protestantism?

How about Buddhism? Hinduism?



All honest questions, just trying to get to know your views a little better.





Here's where I think our misunderstanding is. I don't believe "Islam" to be evil while you, it seems, believe Islam is evil because a very small minority use violence, intimidation, and back up their works with their scriptures (just remember this same minority uses these tactics against others practicing Islam as well) I believe these fringe groups to be politically motivated, not because they truly believe they are doing the work of God. There are a majority of Muslims practicing Islam who are peaceful and are great people. I agree that niceness is not goodness, but goodness is good. There is plenty of good in the religion of Islam. There are a majority of muslims who are being nice out of goodness, not because they want to rape, kill, behead someone.

BroncoBot wrote:

BroncoBot wrote:

There seems to be some misconception on this board.



As for islam, thanks for the perspective but please do not say we are like them and can learn good from islam. Islam is Satan's church. There is no clearer way I can put it.



There are some good people that are islamic but the religion is evil.



So to the point of this thread, it is offensive to me to see anyone claim that His church is anything like the muslim church.

Imua,



Here's some reading for you.



http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705385738/LDS-church-gymnasium-open-for-Muslim-worship-services.html?pg=all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2002/03/a-life-among-muslims" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



http://www.lds.org/ensign/2000/08/a-latter-day-saint-perspective-on-muhammad" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Which includes a great quote by President Gordon B. Hinckley- "Be respectful of the opinions and feelings of other people. Recognize their virtues; don’t look for their faults. Look for their strengths and their virtues, and you will find strength and virtues that will be helpful in your own life."



There's more if you want it. I don't know why the church would go to such effort to reach a hand out to the Muslim community if it is "Satan's church". That's taking it way too far man.

I am looking for the quote that says it is not Satan's church. Did I miss it?



There seem to be crossing arguments going on in this thread.

One point is that we should be friendly and respectful of Muslims. I am fine with that but it does not negate the other point being made which is the evil intention and disposition of Islam as a whole. We can be friendly and wise at the same time.



Remember, niceness is not the same as goodness. Evil people are nice to you right up until they rob, rape or kill you. Niceness does not mean anything when judging character. Too many people make that mistake. Sometimes it is their last.

Does it have to say it is not Satan's church for you to make the connection? Please find for me, since you used the term, where the LDS church believes in any way shape or form that Islam is the church of the devil. I thought (according to McKonkie) that was the Catholic church?



So you guys really believe "Islam" is evil and fringe radicals are actually practicing Islam?

Is Judaism evil?

Is Catholicism?

Is protestantism?

How about Buddhism? Hinduism?



All honest questions, just trying to get to know your views a little better.





Here's where I think our misunderstanding is. I don't believe "Islam" to be evil while you, it seems, believe Islam is evil because a very small minority use violence, intimidation, and back up their works with their scriptures (just remember this same minority uses these tactics against others practicing Islam as well) I believe these fringe groups to be politically motivated, not because they truly believe they are doing the work of God. There are a majority of Muslims practicing Islam who are peaceful and are great people. I agree that niceness is not goodness, but goodness is good. There is plenty of good in the religion of Islam. There are a majority of muslims who are being nice out of goodness, not because they want to rape, kill, behead someone.

Please numerically quantify what you mean by "a very small minority." Because the kind of numbers that appear to me are nothing close to a minority. Better yet let's break it down into 4 categories understanding that this is not so scientific as it is to get a better understanding of what we are talking about.

(1) Muslims that intend to oppress, kill or commit immoral acts in the name of their god. Want Sharia law enforced all over the world.

(2) Those that do not intend to personally commit such acts but tolerate or condone them because of religious belief. Support Sharia Law.

(3) Those that do not condone such acts but do not speak out against them or do not fight against them out of fear or apathy. Tolerate Sharia law.

(4) Those that would be considered American patriots or the equivalent ready to stand up to terrorism, condemn and fight against "radical Islam" like Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas, Iran (both political and spiritual leaders), and other Islamic groups that promote violence in the name of religion. This group also recognizes the right of Israel and America to exist and condemns the speech of those calling for the end of Israel. This group also speaks out against the adoption of Sharia law by American and European courts.



Every Muslim must fit in one of these categories. What percentage would you give each category?