Warning Signs

dmcougar wrote:
AND, who has claimed BYU would have a juggernaut offense?

Certainly nobody with half a brain cell.



Of course, while it would certainly be nice, and maybe Doman will get us there eventually down the road, we don't need a juggernaut offense. We just need a good enough offense to produce and not be a total basketcase like last year. But it will our defense that wins the tough games.

CougarClaw wrote:
Come Back Anae!





















(joking)

Joking aside - he is the OL coach at Arizona - Arizona is ranked in at least one poll after a huge upset win and being 2-0 and BYU OL has not been as good since he left as it was most of the time he was here.



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northerncougar wrote:
We will be 2-2 in 11 days because Riley is average at his best. We are not good on offense this year. What I have been saying all off season. Utah will win this game and will have a losing record in the Pac12.



8-4 is not a respectable season. 8-4 sucks with this schedule. After watching USU Friday and OSU yesterday, I think 6-6 is more likely this year.



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Take a Logic Course.



8-4 sucks with this schedule

6-6 is more likely with this schedule

So 8-4 sucks with this schedule



BTW - this is the 2nd toughest overall schedule BYU has ever had if not the toughest.



Detmer's Heisman Trophy defending season as a senior was as tough or tougher. We lost 3 and tied 2 that year. Kind of like going 8-5 or 9-4. If that sucks. Hope BYU starts scheduling down - and close your eyes and plug your ears next season.



That will, hands down, no close 2nd, be our toughest schedule ever.



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Cougarbib wrote:


Take a Logic Course.



8-4 sucks with this schedule

6-6 is more likely with this schedule

So 8-4 sucks with this schedule



BTW - this is the 2nd toughest overall schedule BYU has ever had if not the toughest.



Detmer's Heisman Trophy defending season as a senior was as tough or tougher. We lost 3 and tied 2 that year. Kind of like going 8-5 or 9-4. If that sucks. Hope BYU starts scheduling down - and close your eyes and plug your ears next season.



That will, hands down, no close 2nd, be our toughest schedule ever.



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I agree there will likely be some rough sailing next year. But did BYU go independent to just keep playing a WAC or MWC-like schedule every year?



Yes, winning is a crucial part of exposure. But nobody cares if just win against the Idaho's and Wyoming's of the world.

I agree with all your overscheduling posts. I have long felt schedules like next year are too much. This year is just about right. Maybe a little tough with the bsu four days after tough rivalry game.

dmcougar wrote:
I agree with all your overscheduling posts. I have long felt schedules like next year are too much. This year is just about right. Maybe a little tough with the bsu four days after tough rivalry game.

I've always stressed "strategic scheduling" when it comes to BYU being successful at independence. Not too much, not too little. 2013 certainly looks exciting. At least on paper. Practically speaking however, like I said, probably some rough sailing next year.



Since we became independent, I've floated this idea about BYU having 8 core games...



1. Utah

2. Utah State

3. Hawaii

4. Boise State

5. Notre Dame

6. Army

7. Navy

8. Air Force





Definitely respectable but no overdoing it.

KingCoug wrote:

I agree with all your overscheduling posts. I have long felt schedules like next year are too much. This year is just about right. Maybe a little tough with the bsu four days after tough rivalry game.

I've always stressed "strategic scheduling" when it comes to BYU being successful at independence. Not too much, not too little. 2013 certainly looks exciting. At least on paper. Practically speaking however, like I said, probably some rough sailing next year.



Since we became independent, I've floated this idea about BYU having 8 core games...



1. Utah

2. Utah State

3. Hawaii

4. Boise State

5. Notre Dame

6. Army

7. Navy

8. Air Force





Definitely respectable but no overdoing it.

On an equal home and away footing. This is even a stretch - but perhaps worth a venture. Until we prove we can acutally beat the teams we have been playing.



This is tougher by far if you add similar teams to it, and as tough no matter who you add to it, as either schedule that catapulted U to two BCS Bowls and Wins and a #2 ranking.



BSU has never - never - played a schedule like this if you add simialr teams - maybe even if you add easier ones. They have played a tougher team or as tough as any one of these. But that was it. One or two of those per season, if any.



TCU - ditto. Until this year. And I will make this bold prediction in-spite of their big opening win. TCU will not go to a BCS Bowl this year.



Hawaii - cupcake city - but it got a BCS Bowl.



Try this for strategic scheduling - because U and BSU and TCU and even lowly Hawaii have proven that it works over and over again.



Play Alabama and the likes - in The Sugar or Fiesta Bowl - when it actually counts for something. Then - having not beaten yourself up and killed your depth - kick their cans. PROVEN FORMULA.

Cougarbib wrote:


Try this for strategic scheduling - because U and BSU and TCU and even lowly Hawaii have proven that it works over and over again.



Play Alabama and the likes - in The Sugar or Fiesta Bowl - when it actually counts for something. Then - having not beaten yourself up and killed your depth - kick their cans. PROVEN FORMULA.

Looking back, I see what you mean...





2004 Utah - 7 MWC, 1 Big 12, 1 PAC 10, 1 ACC, 1 WAC



2006 Boise State - 8 WAC, 2 MWC, 1 PAC 10, 1 FCS



2007 Hawaii - 8 WAC, 2 FCS, 1 MWC, 1 PAC 10



2009 TCU - 8 MWC, 2 ACC, 1 USA, 1 FCS



2009 Boise State - 8 WAC, 1 PAC 10, 1 USA, 1 Mid American, 1 FCS



2010 TCU - 8 WAC, 1 PAC 10, 1 Big 12, 1 USA, 1 FCS







I don't see why something like this wouldn't work... (Just an example)



Utah

Utah State

Hawaii

Boise State

Notre Dame

Army

Navy

Air Force

Stanford

SMU

Central Florida

Weber State?



You have your local interest games in Utah, Utah State, Hawaii, and Boise State.



You have your Independent/Academy games in Notre Dame, Army, Navy, Air Force.



You have your geography (i.e. California, Texas, Florida/South) games in Stanford, SMU, and Central Florida.



The 12 the game you could go with an FSC team like Weber State. Or you could go the other way and do a marquee team.



I also think it's important for BYU, as an independent, to play other private schools.

KingCoug wrote:

Try this for strategic scheduling - because U and BSU and TCU and even lowly Hawaii have proven that it works over and over again.



Play Alabama and the likes - in The Sugar or Fiesta Bowl - when it actually counts for something. Then - having not beaten yourself up and killed your depth - kick their cans. PROVEN FORMULA.

Looking back, I see what you mean...





2004 Utah - 7 MWC, 1 Big 12, 1 PAC 10, 1 ACC, 1 WAC



2006 Boise State - 8 WAC, 2 MWC, 1 PAC 10, 1 FCS



2007 Hawaii - 8 WAC, 2 FCS, 1 MWC, 1 PAC 10



2009 TCU - 8 MWC, 2 ACC, 1 USA, 1 FCS



2009 Boise State - 8 WAC, 1 PAC 10, 1 USA, 1 Mid American, 1 FCS



2010 TCU - 8 WAC, 1 PAC 10, 1 Big 12, 1 USA, 1 FCS







I don't see why something like this wouldn't work... (Just an example)



Utah

Utah State

Hawaii

Boise State

Notre Dame

Army

Navy

Air Force

Stanford

SMU

Central Florida

Weber State?



You have your local interest games in Utah, Utah State, Hawaii, and Boise State.



You have your Independent/Academy games in Notre Dame, Army, Navy, Air Force.



You have your geography (i.e. California, Texas, Florida/South) games in Stanford, SMU, and Central Florida.



The 12 the game you could go with an FSC team like Weber State. Or you could go the other way and do a marquee team.



I also think it's important for BYU, as an independent, to play other private schools.

I only have one issue with stretching to try this type of schedule - I would skip the east coast trip and toss in another PAC team like Colorado or WSU or AZ or OSU - keep it towards what will usually be lower half PAC - although you never now for sure who will be.



And come back and list those actual teams Utah, BSU, Hawaii, and TCU played from the BCS conferences. It tended to be Iowa State from Big 12 or teams like that - not Texas or Oklahoma - generally. It tended not to be USC from PAC. But BSU did play Oregon a time or two - home and away iirc. ANd that was when Oregon was still rising up iirc - not at the peak. But they did play a very good Oregon team. But then - dropped offquickly the rest of the season. BSU opened back east once - seems like it was Ga Tech or Va Tech. ANd won. Then it dropped off quickly from there.



I wish T Hill had a schedule next year like UH, BSU, U or TCU usually had - maybe morelike UH - as a true sophomore. Maybe rack up some gaudy numbers and get his name in the headlights - maybe even go undefeated and have people whining about the weak schedule. THen as a junior and senior - maybe a schedule liek this year - but more balance between home and away - or better yet - Utah's 2004 or 2009 schedule.



Let him contend and eventually win a Heisman trphy with a few people whining about the schedule. A Heisman Trophy is a Heisman Trophy.



He will not get one going 6-6 or 7-5 or worse against a schedule tougher than 95% of teams play - like our 2013 Schedule.

Cougarbib wrote:
And come back and list those actual teams Utah, BSU, Hawaii, and TCU played from the BCS conferences. It tended to be Iowa State from Big 12 or teams like that - not Texas or Oklahoma - generally. It tended not to be USC from PAC. But BSU did play Oregon a time or two - home and away iirc. ANd that was when Oregon was still rising up iirc - not at the peak. But they did play a very good Oregon team. But then - dropped offquickly the rest of the season. BSU opened back east once - seems like it was Ga Tech or Va Tech. ANd won. Then it dropped off quickly from there.

Utah 2004 - Texas A&M, Arizona



Boise State 2006 - Oregon State



Hawaii 2007 - Washington



Utah 2008 - Michigan, Oregon State



TCU 2009 - Virginia, Clemson



Boise State 2009 - Oregon



TCU 2010 - Oregon State, Baylor

I wish T Hill had a schedule next year like UH, BSU, U or TCU usually had - maybe morelike UH - as a true sophomore. Maybe rack up some gaudy numbers and get his name in the headlights - maybe even go undefeated and have people whining about the weak schedule. THen as a junior and senior - maybe a schedule liek this year - but more balance between home and away - or better yet - Utah's 2004 or 2009 schedule.

Next year will definitely be a baptism of fire for him.

I was disappointed with the run D. Seemed like they were gashing up the middle quite a bit. Disappointing from an aspect of our game that's supposed to be the strength of our strength.

KingCoug wrote:

Take a Logic Course.



8-4 sucks with this schedule

6-6 is more likely with this schedule

So 8-4 sucks with this schedule



BTW - this is the 2nd toughest overall schedule BYU has ever had if not the toughest.



Detmer's Heisman Trophy defending season as a senior was as tough or tougher. We lost 3 and tied 2 that year. Kind of like going 8-5 or 9-4. If that sucks. Hope BYU starts scheduling down - and close your eyes and plug your ears next season.



That will, hands down, no close 2nd, be our toughest schedule ever.



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I agree there will likely be some rough sailing next year. But did BYU go independent to just keep playing a WAC or MWC-like schedule every year?



Yes, winning is a crucial part of exposure. But nobody cares if just win against the Idaho's and Wyoming's of the world.

Nobody cares? And yet here we are - already moved right up to 25 in the AP Poll.



The reality is - nobody cares very much about how good a BYU opponent is if we lose. Losses to U, BSU, ND, and GT would take us right out of the polls if they occur. Substitute four wins over MWC teams or Colorado or Northwestern, or Duke, or Vanderbilt - and BAM. Undefeated. Top 6. BCS Bowl. Chance To Make A Huge Statement.

northerncougar wrote:
We will be 2-2 in 11 days because Riley is average at his best. We are not good on offense this year. What I have been saying all off season. Utah will win this game and will have a losing record in the Pac12.



8-4 is not a respectable season. 8-4 sucks with this schedule. After watching USU Friday and OSU yesterday, I think 6-6 is more likely this year.



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dude, i get your concerns but man you have the most pessimistic attitude about byu football. byu has problems but so does utah. there is a reason we are slightly favored even with it at utah's place. we are at least slightly better than they are.

This is not a hard schedule. The very best teams that BYU is playing against will just barely go bowling. I don't predict more than 8 wins for anyone other than Boise State and *maybe* Notre Dame (because of all the cupcakes they play).



Utah State might get 8 wins beating up on the WAC.



BYU has zero worldbeaters on the schedule. This is not even half the schedule that Max Hall played either his junior or senior year.



The Max Hall cougars would go through this years schedule without a loss. Our offensive identity died, and turned into defensive identity and strength. It is just too bad that the Max Hall cougars didn't have a defense half this good, they would have run the table and probably won a BCS game or two.

jonnylingo wrote:

We will be 2-2 in 11 days because Riley is average at his best. We are not good on offense this year. What I have been saying all off season. Utah will win this game and will have a losing record in the Pac12.



8-4 is not a respectable season. 8-4 sucks with this schedule. After watching USU Friday and OSU yesterday, I think 6-6 is more likely this year.



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dude, i get your concerns but man you have the most pessimistic attitude about byu football. byu has problems but so does utah. there is a reason we are slightly favored even with it at utah's place. we are at least slightly better than they are.

I disagree. I am not pessimistic at all. I don't believe in this offense enough to even be pessimistic.



If BYU wins on Saturday, my whole outlook will change. Given the last 16 years or so, especially the past two where we lose to a worse team or get destroyed, my ability to believe is completely gone. I want a BYU team to finally rise up and put a beat down on Utah. I see very little chance of that, and so I'll take a win however it comes. I just don't see it happening.



No question Utah has issues. That is why BYU will have to screw it up to lose. And I am petrified that they will. They have so many times in the past.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
This is not a hard schedule. The very best teams that BYU is playing against will just barely go bowling. I don't predict more than 8 wins for anyone other than Boise State and *maybe* Notre Dame (because of all the cupcakes they play).



Utah State might get 8 wins beating up on the WAC.



BYU has zero worldbeaters on the schedule. This is not even half the schedule that Max Hall played either his junior or senior year.



The Max Hall cougars would go through this years schedule without a loss. Our offensive identity died, and turned into defensive identity and strength. It is just too bad that the Max Hall cougars didn't have a defense half this good, they would have run the table and probably won a BCS game or two.

Ding, ding, ding!!! We have a winner!!!

northerncougar wrote:
I don't believe in this offense enough to even be pessimistic..

Your problem(and I mean that in a nice way) is that you have not yet come to terms with teh fact that BYU is not a team that wins with offense first. Those days are gone unbder BM. We are not a score 50 pts team anymore. We do not win 52-49, we win 24-17. defense first, field position, time of possession, with enough offense to get it done.



We are not a throw 50x+ per game team every game, we have changed, and some BYU fans have not evolved with that change just yet.



Point being, we can have a mediocre offense this year and still be very successful. In fact, I expect it.



We beat Utah by scoring 20 Saturday. They will not reach that mark, unless we gift them the points.

As for degree of difficulty - take a look at the Sagrain ratings and AP rankings - these teams are good. Season is young. We run the table - it's better than anything that BSU, TCU, UT did to get to BCS game. We are playing away games at difficult venues - UT, BSU, ND, GT. Winning away games is difficult against good teams and especially against those trying to make a statement about SOS.



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Lawboy wrote:

I don't believe in this offense enough to even be pessimistic..

Your problem(and I mean that in a nice way) is that you have not yet come to terms with teh fact that BYU is not a team that wins with offense first. Those days are gone unbder BM. We are not a score 50 pts team anymore. We do not win 52-49, we win 24-17. defense first, field position, time of possession, with enough offense to get it done.



We are not a throw 50x+ per game team every game, we have changed, and some BYU fans have not evolved with that change just yet.



Point being, we can have a mediocre offense this year and still be very successful. In fact, I expect it.



We beat Utah by scoring 20 Saturday. They will not reach that mark, unless we gift them the points.

I get what you are saying, but that isn't my problem. I don't care how BYU scores, but I don't think this offense is good enough, against a good D, to score enough points.



I believe completely in our D. I don't think our offense is good. At all.

northerncougar wrote:

northerncougar wrote:
I don't believe in this offense enough to even be pessimistic..

Your problem(and I mean that in a nice way) is that you have not yet come to terms with teh fact that BYU is not a team that wins with offense first. Those days are gone unbder BM. We are not a score 50 pts team anymore. We do not win 52-49, we win 24-17. defense first, field position, time of possession, with enough offense to get it done.



We are not a throw 50x+ per game team every game, we have changed, and some BYU fans have not evolved with that change just yet.



Point being, we can have a mediocre offense this year and still be very successful. In fact, I expect it.



We beat Utah by scoring 20 Saturday. They will not reach that mark, unless we gift them the points.

I get what you are saying, but that isn't my problem. I don't care how BYU scores, but I don't think this offense is good enough, against a good D, to score enough points.



I believe completely in our D. I don't think our offense is good. At all.

Good thing this week the difference between their O and our D is greater than the delta between our O and their D.



BYU's offense will be more successful than Utah's.