How did Frank Jackson and BYU get so estranged?

Serious question here, how did the relationship between FJ and BYU sour so much so shortly?



FJ has gone from a BYU commit to a potential DUKE recruit, which makes a ton of sense. But what doesn't make sense is that Utah and Stanford are 2 and 3 on his list.



Why Utah? What have they done to garner interest from a high level recruit?


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Is it something BYU did or just that FJ's priorities have changed? I would guess he's just listening more and more to the hype surrounding him and letting it go to his head.

Does seem a bit odd. Doubt it is anything BYU did - could be though. He has a whole bunch of people in his ear.



The fact BYU's two best players in the last decade aren't doing much at a professional level could have a lot to do with it. Plus, the only BYU coach with legit NBA experience is gone, now coaching across the street. If FJ wants to go pro and have a long career in the NBA, I can see why BYU wouldn't instill a lot of confidence.



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I heard a rumor that he and Quincy Lewis actually do not like each other and that BYU hiring him was somewhat of a slap in his face. Obviously, FJ was already likely headed to Duke at that time, but it could account for how BYU went from 2nd to essentially not even on the list anymore.

But I thought hiring Quincy was supposed secure our chances at getting FJ? Doh!



That's a good theory. And, let's be honest, the odds of FJ coming to BYU were slim.



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Gunk wrote:
But I thought hiring Quincy was supposed secure our chances at getting FJ? Doh!



That's a good theory. And, let's be honest, the odds of FJ coming to BYU were slim.



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Yeah, as I see it they went from 1 in 100 to .0001 in a hundred. basically zero to zero.

hawkwing wrote:

But I thought hiring Quincy was supposed secure our chances at getting FJ? Doh!



That's a good theory. And, let's be honest, the odds of FJ coming to BYU were slim.



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Yeah, as I see it they went from 1 in 100 to .0001 in a hundred. basically zero to zero.

So you're saying we've got a chance!

Hmmm... pure speculation on my part. But let's see here, as a 15-year old SO, Frank Jackson loved BYU and couldn't wait to be a part of the program. But now, as an 18-year old SR he doesn't want to come to BYU.



Now, what is the 800-lbs gorilla at BYU? Why, that would be the Honor Code.



And is there anything that could change in the life for a young man that might start happening between the ages of 15 and 18?



It couldn't possibly be that a young man may no longer want to adhere to the Honor Code, could it?

I highly doubt that. If he wasn't so good, he would still be committed. He looked for a better opportunity, his scholarship has been given to another recruit. He moves on. If by some chance, he has a change of heart, we might not be able to accept him.

I just find it interesting that you go from fully committed to BYU to not even having BYU in your Final 4 yet Utah now makes the list?

SpiffCoug wrote:
I just find it interesting that you go from fully committed to BYU to not even having BYU in your Final 4 yet Utah now makes the list?

That to me says I'm pissed at BYU and want to stick it to them. He grew up in Utah. He knows what it means to put Utah over BYU.

Or it just shows that he's not going to BYU, and really doesn't have an interest in Utah either. But wants to stick it in BYU's craw that he's not going there. I think he's just using Utah. It's between Stanford & Duke.

SpiffCoug wrote:
Or it just shows that he's not going to BYU, and really doesn't have an interest in Utah either. But wants to stick it in BYU's craw that he's not going there. I think he's just using Utah. It's between Stanford & Duke.

We're in agreement that Utah is just a tool to show BYU he doesn't like them. The question is what caused him to not like BYU so much that he not only goes back on his commitment but has to pour lemon juice on the wound. Seems like more than just not wanting to live the Honor Code.

Isn't he planning on serving a mission right out of high school? Or is he playing for a year first? If so, HC issues probably isn't the reason. If he isn't serving right away, then HC may be the reason, in which case I'd say he may just be giving lip service to the whole mission thing. Jimmer didn't serve. He probably thinks he's better or has a better shot in the pros than Jimmer - after all Duke didn't even know Jimmer existed.



As a sophomore he probably wanted to make sure he had a bird in hand, so accepted an offer from BYU, knowing full well if he got better and moved up in the rankings he could ditch BYU and take a better offer. Smart move.



If I am an elite athlete and Duke is knocking, I'd answer the door.



The inclusion of Utah is odd. It's a middle finger to BYU.



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Last I heard he was rethinking his decision to go on a mission.

Gunk wrote:
The inclusion of Utah is odd. It's a middle finger to BYU.

I don't see what's so hard to comprehend about a guy being interested in Utah hoops and not BYU. Utah is coming off a #15 ranking to end the year in his 4th season (after taking over a 13-18 squad from Boylen), a six-point loss to Duke in the Sweet Sixteen, and just happens to be returning nearly every player of any importance from last season. They've also got two players on the roster who, barring injury, are near locks to be drafted by the NBA (Loveridge, Poeltl)



BYU is coming off yet another unranked end to the season (they didn't even get a single vote, so they effectively finished ranked 40th at best) after yet another early exit from the tournament in the head coach's 10th season, and will have a completely different look than last year. BYU has one player who has an inkling of NBA potential (KC).



What's so shocking that a guy might prefer the Utes over BYU given what each team has done lately? It could be that Jackson has his sights set on the NBA, and sees Stanford and Duke as promising paths, but also sees Utah as a viable path that would also allow him to stay closer to home. He may not see BYU as a viable path to the NBA, and Rose's track record of not putting guys into the Association bears that impression out.



I see it as less a middle finger to BYU, and more an indictment of why BYU will continue to fail to land blue-chip hoops prospects if they keep on this path.

snoscythe wrote:

The inclusion of Utah is odd. It's a middle finger to BYU.

I don't see what's so hard to comprehend about a guy being interested in Utah hoops and not BYU. Utah is coming off a #15 ranking to end the year in his 4th season (after taking over a 13-18 squad from Boylen), a six-point loss to Duke in the Sweet Sixteen, and just happens to be returning nearly every player of any importance from last season. They've also got two players on the roster who, barring injury, are near locks to be drafted by the NBA (Loveridge, Poeltl)



BYU is coming off yet another unranked end to the season (they didn't even get a single vote, so they effectively finished ranked 40th at best) after yet another early exit from the tournament in the head coach's 10th season, and will have a completely different look than last year. BYU has one player who has an inkling of NBA potential (KC).



What's so shocking that a guy might prefer the Utes over BYU given what each team has done lately? It could be that Jackson has his sights set on the NBA, and sees Stanford and Duke as promising paths, but also sees Utah as a viable path that would also allow him to stay closer to home. He may not see BYU as a viable path to the NBA, and Rose's track record of not putting guys into the Association bears that impression out.



I see it as less a middle finger to BYU, and more an indictment of why BYU will continue to fail to land blue-chip hoops prospects if they keep on this path.

Don't really disagree with you. Pretty much said the same thing. The last two BYU leading scorers have done hardly anything at the professional level. Both are struggling at that next level because of an inability to play defense.



Also, as I mentioned, BYU lost its only coach with NBA experience to UVU. Makes perfect sense FJ would have his sights set on the likes of Duke or Stanford. Utah makes sense too from that regard, a bit. I could be mistaken, but the last Ute to make it in the NBA is Bogut. Utah is hardly cranking out NBA caliber players. No question they had an excellent season and they likely will this next season. Whether that's a trend or an anomaly is yet to be determined.



FJ knew all this 6 months ago. Six months ago BYU was on the list. BYU is no longer on the list and was replaced by Utah. Something changed.



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Wouldn't you count Kaufusi as a solid NBA prospect? So that would match KC and Kaufusi to Poeltl and Loveridge in my estimation (I'd probably put my money KC and Kaufusi if they played two on two). Add in the return of Mika next year and we still have two pretty solid NBA prospects (at least until opposing coaches and media start crying about age and complaining that they are old and probably shouldn't even be considered for selection in the NBA because of age. Odd thing is the NBA has development leagues for kids to "grow up" and mature before being forced to play against grown men. Funny how that works.

imuakahuku wrote:
Wouldn't you count Kaufusi as a solid NBA prospect? So that would match KC and Kaufusi to Poeltl and Loveridge in my estimation (I'd probably put my money KC and Kaufusi if they played two on two). Add in the return of Mika next year and we still have two pretty solid NBA prospects (at least until opposing coaches and media start crying about age and complaining that they are old and probably shouldn't even be considered for selection in the NBA because of age. Odd thing is the NBA has development leagues for kids to "grow up" and mature before being forced to play against grown men. Funny how that works.

For the other poster asking about Utah's recent history of NBA draftees other than Bogut, Delon Wright was just drafted last season out of Utah by the Raptors...



The problem with BYU fans assessing the NBA prospects of BYU players is that most tend to watch a whole lot of BYU basketball, but not a lot of other teams beyond SportsCenter. So we're very familiar with our players and their "potential" because we see every flash of it and remember it. When it comes time for the NBA draft, the scouts and GMs watch all the film on every player to make their decisions, so they're watching just as much Utah film as BYU film. I doubt any BYU fans can say they watch as much Utes hoops as BYU hoops. So there's a selection bias going on with BYU fans (or any school's fans, for that matter) in comparing their players' ability to others and projecting ahead to the draft. I doubt you've watched as much Poeltl/Loveridge as you have Kaufusi/Collinsworth, which might explain why your comparison deviates so much from the more objective assessments floating around out there--you're basing your assessment off what you've seen and felt, which I presume is a pretty one-sided assessment.



Furthermore, there's a world of difference between a "solid NBA prospect," as you categorize Kaufusi/KC/Mika, and a "near-lock to be drafted", as I categorized Loveridge and Poeltl. Tyler Haws was a solid NBA prospect, but didn't even get a D-League invite. Poeltl, for example, is projected to be a top-10 pick in the 2016 draft and is the #1 rated sophomore in the nation:



http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jakob-Poeltl-63039/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



KC is BYU's highest rated NBA prospect, and he doesn't even crack the top-50 in the senior class of 2016....that's not even accounting for one-and-dones and other early entrants into the draft:



http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Kyle-Collinsworth-16470/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



He's not even close enough to the radar to merit a full profile on the site. Also, I don't think anyone other than BYU fans is projecting Kaufusi or Mika to be drafted at this point. Yeah, they have potential, but potential tends to get you a D-League invite or a trip to Europe/Asia, not a spot in the draft where teams only get two picks.

imuakahuku wrote:
Wouldn't you count Kaufusi as a solid NBA prospect? So that would match KC and Kaufusi to Poeltl and Loveridge in my estimation (I'd probably put my money KC and Kaufusi if they played two on two). Add in the return of Mika next year and we still have two pretty solid NBA prospects (at least until opposing coaches and media start crying about age and complaining that they are old and probably shouldn't even be considered for selection in the NBA because of age. Odd thing is the NBA has development leagues for kids to "grow up" and mature before being forced to play against grown men. Funny how that works.

Like Sno says, I watch a lot of BYU basketball, but unlike many other BYU fans I haven't seen anything that would ever lead me to believe that Kaufusi has a chance to get drafted. We're talking about a guy who on the year was statistically less or about as impressive as Luke Worthington. He certainly had a good half in a few games, but I honestly don't even project him to play Euroball.