BYU is "Ugly"?

So..........your kid prays, gets an answer that BYU is the place to go, commits to BYU, decides to take a pleasure trip to ND, before he goes to ND he gets word that BYU doesn't want him if he trips to ND, kid still trips to ND.



Sounds like someone needs better Sunday school teachers. Try and paint Bronco the bad guy all you want, but you have a kid who had a choice with clear-cut consequences, and now he is trying to push the blame elsewhere. Looks like he's going to have to pay his own way to follow personal revelation now.

I repeat,and no this is not Sunday School,the kid had every right under NCAA rules to trip to ND and he did NOT break any commandments by so doing,even the HC.if he says his original aim was to see some friends,and to check out ND,then who are you to decide it wasn't,despite your construction of a timeline.You guys are so quick to participate in character assasination of any prospective Cougar who doesn't tow the line as you think correct.As far as Bronco's actions,we'll find out sooner or later what we need to,to formulate an opinion,and I'm pretty sure he can defend himself.He's a great coach,but that doesn't mean he's perfect,or that he handled this situation perfectly.while i'm on the subject of abusive fans,i actually saw "fans" in our section this year yelling at Brian Logan to get off the field,because he got beat in the TCU game.Dang,he's one of our own,and here were these idiots yelling at him for gettin' beat while playing his guts out.ever ask yourself where all the anger comes from?THAT was ugly.

clemdiggitydog1 wrote:
I repeat,and no this is not Sunday School,the kid had every right under NCAA rules to trip to ND and he did NOT break any commandments by so doing,even the HC.if he says his original aim was to see some friends,and to check out ND,then who are you to decide it wasn't,despite your construction of a timeline.You guys are so quick to participate in character assasination of any prospective Cougar who doesn't tow the line as you think correct.As far as Bronco's actions,we'll find out sooner or later what we need to,to formulate an opinion,and I'm pretty sure he can defend himself.He's a great coach,but that doesn't mean he's perfect,or that he handled this situation perfectly.while i'm on the subject of abusive fans,i actually saw "fans" in our section this year yelling at Brian Logan to get off the field,because he got beat in the TCU game.Dang,he's one of our own,and here were these idiots yelling at him for gettin' beat while playing his guts out.ever ask yourself where all the anger comes from?THAT was ugly.

I can't wait to see Logan play this year! All the experience he learned will make him play even better! All QB's tried picking on him and he broke up more passes than anyone else on our team. He's a baller! 8)

clemdiggitydog1 wrote:
I repeat,and no this is not Sunday School,the kid had every right under NCAA rules to trip to ND and he did NOT break any commandments by so doing,even the HC.if he says his original aim was to see some friends,and to check out ND,then who are you to decide it wasn't,despite your construction of a timeline.You guys are so quick to participate in character assasination of any prospective Cougar who doesn't tow the line as you think correct.As far as Bronco's actions,we'll find out sooner or later what we need to,to formulate an opinion,and I'm pretty sure he can defend himself.He's a great coach,but that doesn't mean he's perfect,or that he handled this situation perfectly.while i'm on the subject of abusive fans,i actually saw "fans" in our section this year yelling at Brian Logan to get off the field,because he got beat in the TCU game.Dang,he's one of our own,and here were these idiots yelling at him for gettin' beat while playing his guts out.ever ask yourself where all the anger comes from?THAT was ugly.

Yes, but he did break trust. If he had even done this a month earlier, it would not have been so bad. His timing was GREAT for ND, no matter what Bronco did or said.



I agree with you about the bad fan behavior. That has been my biggest complaint about BYU fans for many years. I have seen it on this forum too. After the NM loss, you would think that we had the worst players and the worst coaches in the NCAA, and that they all deliberately played poorly to throw the game. :sick:

by the way Mars,there's this little thing called agency....18 year olds are entitled to exercise it as well,and sometimes the results are messy and unpredictable.

clemdiggitydog1 wrote:
by the way Mars,there's this little thing called agency....18 year olds are entitled to exercise it as well,and sometimes the results are messy and unpredictable.

No, really? Well, then let's all act as stupidly as possible!! :roll:



Agency isn't free son. Kona is learning this now.

clemdiggitydog1 wrote:
by the way Mars,there's this little thing called agency....18 year olds are entitled to exercise it as well,and sometimes the results are messy and unpredictable.

Wait, so someone using agency can't make the wrong choice? And, if it's possible that they can make the wrong choice, no one should pay any attention to it, even if it negatively affects their team?

Schmoe,I was responding to what I believe is a bizarre and absurd notion that Mars posited in his opening assertion that those of us who are "supporting his right to go to to ND are supporting him not responding to his prayers" or some such rubbish.that is where the supporting free agency comment came in,although I'm now much too tired to try to describe anymore why I think it's better for us to support his free agency than to ravage him,his motives,or his dad here on Cougarcorner.it's just what happens when you're runnin' with the big dogs in college football recruiting,not a morality play as some would make it.



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Well, if he feels that he has been inspired to go to BYU and knows that going to ND will jeopardize his opportunity to do so, then I would say that he is making an unwise decision. It may not be a question of what is 'legal' according to the NCAA or of morals, but a question of character and doing what he feels he NEEDS to do to keep his commitments and do what he feels the Lord wants him to do. If your coach asks you to run a mile and you say 'no,' it's not morally wrong for you to decline, but it shows a lack of character.

Schmoe wrote:
Well, if he feels that he has been inspired to go to BYU and knows that going to ND will jeopardize his opportunity to do so, then I would say that he is making an unwise decision. It may not be a question of what is 'legal' according to the NCAA or of morals, but a question of character and doing what he feels he NEEDS to do to keep his commitments and do what he feels the Lord wants him to do. If your coach asks you to run a mile and you say 'no,' it's not morally wrong for you to decline, but it shows a lack of character.

Well said.

clemdiggitydog1 wrote:
Schmoe,I was responding to what I believe is a bizarre and absurd notion that Mars posited in his opening assertion that those of us who are "supporting his right to go to to ND are supporting him not responding to his prayers" or some such rubbish.that is where the supporting free agency comment came in,although I'm now much too tired to try to describe anymore why I think it's better for us to support his free agency than to ravage him,his motives,or his dad here on Cougarcorner.it's just what happens when you're runnin' with the big dogs in college football recruiting,not a morality play as some would make it.

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After reading Kona threads for 45 minutes and keeping my ideas to myself, I came across this gem and had to log in and comment. After hearing Bronco speak for the last five years about the mission of the football team and the place that football itself holds on the priority list, how can you suggest that the BYU football program act a certain way just because that is how the "big dogs" do things? Either you have not been listening to Bronco, or else you feel that he is just giving lip service to what the BYU admins want to hear. Bronco absolutely believes that he can win on the field against the big dogs without having to behave as they do off the field. We can debate whether that is a possibility, but the fact that he is willing to hold recruits to the consequences that come when they excercise their "free" agency makes me proud of him and his program. I would much rather see things unfold as they have in Kona's situation than read the headlines I saw during Crowton's attempt to run "with the big dogs in college football recruiting."

clemdiggitydog1 wrote:
by the way Mars,there's this little thing called agency....18 year olds are entitled to exercise it as well,and sometimes the results are messy and unpredictable.

Sometimes the results are predictable. If the coach says "do that, and I yank your scholarship," you shouldn't cry when you do it and the coach yanks his scholarship.



Agency doesn't justify him blatantly disregarding what he claims was personal revelation. It explains it, but it doesn't make it right. I can explain every horrendous act in history by pointing to agency, but that doesn't somehow make it right.

We all have agency. We do not have the freedom to avoid the consequences of how we exercise that agency. The sooner and more fully we accept that the better off we will all be



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Without intending to take this discussion on too much of a tangent, here are a couple of parallels based on personal revelation:



1) An 18 year old receives personal revelation that the Law of Chastity is real and he should obey this law. He is subsequently confronted with a situation in which he has an opportunity to violate this law. It isn't against any law or NCAA regulation, but his Bishop, Stake President and Prophet have each advised him that this kind of activity will jepoardize his opportunity to serve a mission.



2) An 18 year old receives personal revelation that the Word of Wisdom is ordained of God and he should guard himslef to be sure that he is always in compliance. At a party, he is invited to partake of alcohol and drugs. His parents have told him that this is unacceptable behavior and a consequence of his participation will be loss of driving privileges. Further, he has received the same warning that lack of adherence to the WoW may also jeopardize his mission plans.



In each case, the 18 year old in question has a decision to make. Will he remain true to the revelation he has received or not. Character is defined by making the difficult choice when faced with the illusion of happiness for making the wrong choice.



Choosing ND over BYU isn't the same as choosing immorality over chastity, but choosing to ignore specific personal revelation can cause long-term pain and sadness. If Schwenke was inspired that he should attend BYU, then there are reasons for that. Only Schwenke knows what was revealed to him. The rest of us are speculating based on what he's told us.



I have a very good friend who was trying to decide which HS to attend (she had 3 options: the local public school and 2 elite private schools). She was really challenged with making the decision. It was a nasty time for her because she saw benefits to each option (and she was 14). There were many variables to consider (though none athletic, this was a mostly academic/social decision, but she was being pursued by the private schools). She prayed and fasted and was told thru revelation, in no uncertain terms, that she should attend the public school. After making her decision, one of the private schools told her they would waive tuition for all 4 years if she decided to enroll. Money wasn't the issue for her family, and for lots of our friends, this seemed to throw a wrench in her decision process ("They really want you! Go!") However, at age 14, she told them that her decision was made, because Heavenly Father had already told her that she should attend the public school. So the carrot now being dangled wasn't really valuable to her (no illusion of happiness). Some friends couldn't understand her decision, but for those that knew her, it was clear what she had done: remained true to what she knew.

Can it be said any better than that?

BYU



http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_3BaJMgGKAmE/SMUrcCMY8mI/AAAAAAAAEqw/VrXy9DKxTgI/s400/byu.jpg" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">





Ugly



http://www.spunangel.com/uploaded_images/ugly_person-720907.jpg" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">



Which is uglier?



Yeah, BYU. You're right.

Urroner - you have one of those faces that kind of grow on people ..... it takes on a .... uh ...... sort of a ........ a familiarity ..... like a comfortable pair of worn out tennis shoes!!! That's it!! Worn out tennis shoes that I just love!!! LOL!!!!

Ddawg wrote:
Urroner - you have one of those faces that kind of grow on people ..... it takes on a .... uh ...... sort of a ........ a familiarity ..... like a comfortable pair of worn out tennis shoes!!! That's it!! Worn out tennis shoes that I just love!!! LOL!!!!

Do they smell also?

urroner wrote:

Urroner - you have one of those faces that kind of grow on people ..... it takes on a .... uh ...... sort of a ........ a familiarity ..... like a comfortable pair of worn out tennis shoes!!! That's it!! Worn out tennis shoes that I just love!!! LOL!!!!

Do they smell also?

Like daisy's, cotton candy & pepperoni pizza!!! A Heavenly combo!!!! LOL!!!