Should Nelson Have Told Coaches

hawkwing wrote:

hawkwing wrote:

hawkwing wrote:
If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

At that point we still have munns and lark as well. might be good to use nelson in another capacity. i am still a big proponent of the situational qb, but i don't think bronco seems to like that idea.

If that situation plays out, which I hope it doesn't (I'd much rather Heaps fulfill his destiny!) then I am okay with Munns, Lark, or Heaps, whomever wins out in spring camp. As long as the decision is made by the end of Spring.

100 percent agree.

Sorry, meant to include Nelson on that list too, don't know if you still 100% agree.

ProV1 wrote:

...unless it turns out Heaps just sucks and is not the future. This is still a possibility after all--he could be an Engemann or Olsen 2.0...

I have seen nothing yet to suggest such insults. Quick release, great arm strength, good decisions, and a great attitude. He needs more reps, yes, and he'll quickly improve. Once the WRs get used to his throw they'll come along. Let's all collectively hope he doesn't suffer the injuries Olsen had to endure.

Lawboy wrote:
Well, consider he was also playing the FSU game with a broken finger on his throwing hand--confirmed by Bronco--and the coaches knew it, not so sure the staff would have cared unless it hindered his play. As far as I can tell it didn't.

hawkwing wrote:
If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

BlueIsBetter wrote:

If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Mars wrote:

hawkwing wrote:
If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

kitic77 wrote:
As a strong member of the Nelson Camp, I commend Riley for his bravery and toughness, but in the end an injured player doesn't help the team. But in the end, if he was injured he should have spoken up sooner and allowed other QBs (Heaps, Lark) take more reps and get ready.



It's my feeling that too often football players try to play tough. This doesn't help the team and if they keep playing/practicing prevents the backup from getting the reps necessary to develop. If you're hurt, say so and get fixed.

snoscythe wrote:

BlueIsBetter wrote:

If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

declocoug wrote:

Mars wrote:

hawkwing wrote:
If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

Agreed Sno, and if you still can't see why Bronco felt that Nelson was as efficient at doing his thing as Heaps was at doing his, then I feel you're just being stubborn. Add to that that Nelson provided much needed leadership and some experience on a team that lacks both of those qualities this year, and was efficient as he was with the injuries he was dealing with, it becomes easy to see why Bronco made the decisions he did. And there's no way Nelson was being selfish. Do we all remember Max Hall being injured at Wyoming and playing with a AC sprain in his throwing shoulder? Excruciating injury but I didn't see any criticism then.



Here's hoping Heaps (or whoever the QB is) has an amazing night on Friday.

jonnylingo wrote:

snoscythe wrote:

BlueIsBetter wrote:

If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

Agreed Sno, and if you still can't see why Bronco felt that Nelson was as efficient at doing his thing as Heaps was at doing his, then I feel you're just being stubborn. Add to that that Nelson provided much needed leadership and some experience on a team that lacks both of those qualities this year, and was efficient as he was with the injuries he was dealing with, it becomes easy to see why Bronco made the decisions he did. And there's no way Nelson was being selfish. Do we all remember Max Hall being injured at Wyoming and playing with a AC sprain in his throwing shoulder? Excruciating injury but I didn't see any criticism then.



Here's hoping Heaps (or whoever the QB is) has an amazing night on Friday.

My questions if all of what you say is true, why did he even start jake at all and not just red shirt him? If both were really 'ready to go' like bronco says why in the world does he play jake or do a two qb system. why not pick nelson ad let jake be a back up or redshirt? I wish i could just sit down with bronco and really know why he made that decision.

snoscythe wrote:

BlueIsBetter wrote:

If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

BlueIsBetter wrote:

Mars wrote:

hawkwing wrote:
If Heaps hasn't improved enough to clearly be the starter by the end of the year then I think it will be a very good thing to have Nelson back as QB, because it will mean that Heaps wont cut it as a BYU QB and needs to be benched.

Yeah, and Riley Nelson is the obvious answer to that. I'm sorry but if Jake can't cut it this year, then it is going to Lark... If Heaps can't cut it, then an "unrusty" Lark and 35 pounds lighter Munns are the answer. Riley isn't a prototypical BYU quarterback, and our OC isn't nearly good enough to change our offense. It is amazing that you all still can't see this.

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

Riley Nelson at qb = DETOUR from BYU offense. I'm not sure how any of you can see anything different after watching him tuck and run the ball time after time, and not make throws. Jake isn't connecting all the time, but at least he's looking. Did you all know Riley is our 3rd all time rushing-est quarterback, in how many minutes of play?



Riley Nelson playing qb = DETOUR from BYU offense.

Italics wrote:

snoscythe wrote:

Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

Riley Nelson at qb = DETOUR from BYU offense. I'm not sure how any of you can see anything different after watching him tuck and run the ball time after time, and not make throws. Jake isn't connecting all the time, but at least he's looking... Riley Nelson playing qb = DETOUR from BYU offense.

Agreed. Heaps is young - and while he may be failing to connect on some passes - we at least know he has the ABILITY to throw a good spiral and a accurate pass... Nelson just doesn't have that ability. It's like starting a crappy batter in baseball over someone who is having trouble hitting the ball, but you know that once he does he'll hit homeruns on a regular basis.

Mars wrote:

BlueIsBetter wrote:

Mars wrote:
Agreed. If it's not Heaps, and I think it is, it will be Lark. It's been proven fairly strikingly that Nelson isn't a BYU QB.

If so, it's also been proven that Heaps isn't our answer at QB either, as he has been even less efficient.

Riley Nelson at qb = DETOUR from BYU offense. I'm not sure how any of you can see anything different after watching him tuck and run the ball time after time, and not make throws. Jake isn't connecting all the time, but at least he's looking... Riley Nelson playing qb = DETOUR from BYU offense.

Agreed. Heaps is young - and while he may be failing to connect on some passes - we at least know he has the ABILITY to throw a good spiral and a accurate pass... Nelson just doesn't have that ability. It's like starting a crappy batter in baseball over someone who is having trouble hitting the ball, but you know that once he does he'll hit homeruns on a regular basis.

Exactly. Nelson is a good guy and an atheltic football player, but he's also an abortion to the proud BYU QB history. Heaps is very different, a good young passing QB who was forced into the fire early but is improving, and the team simply looks much better with him as the main man.

f Heaps has proven he's not a good QB this year, then Jacobsen has proven he's not a good WR this year and Reynolds has proven he's not a good OL this year. Those two guys have both done very poorly... but we all know that's not really the case with these guys.

Nelson is more like Kariya or Hafoka, guys who have had numerous chances to prove themselves over multiple seasons and just couldn't step up to a high enough level. Except more injury prone. [/color]

BlueIsBetter wrote:
same old argument... Except I disagree that Nelson would do more with more snaps. He has had almost two years getting 2nd string snaps, and was preferred in spring camp. Jake is taking the ball and running with it and I would hope that we all be supportive of him.

Riley is severely limited physically, and with Jake it is all mental, and speed of the game. You can fix that with snaps and timing, and experience. You can't fix any of Riley's flaws as a quarterback. He has had plenty of time to work on them, and there are still huge gaps.

I suggest all of you Riley guys, if you can't get behind Heaps, then just start following Georgia Tech, Nevada, or Air Force, because that is the type of football that you are hoping for.

snoscythe wrote:

same old argument... Except I disagree that Nelson would do more with more snaps. He has had almost two years getting 2nd string snaps, and was preferred in spring camp. Jake is taking the ball and running with it and I would hope that we all be supportive of him.

How do you define supportive? Like the support you guys were giving Nelson when he was starting? Like the support you are giving Kariya? Like the support you are giving Anae?

snoscythe wrote:
I think Heaps has the tools to be our QB of the future. That said, he hasn't sealed the deal yet. He is digressing in his fundamentals--poor footwork, mishandling the rush by retreating and throwing off the back foot, his follow through has become very tight over the last two games, which has affected his accuracy. Heaps has a long way to go before he is crowned our QB for next season, much less the next three years. He has got to start progressing, not digressing. Saying these things is not being unsupportive--it's simply being honest, much like saying Anae can't make in game adjustments and Kariya is too slow to get to the corner.

snocythe wrote:
Disagree. Again, Nelson was more effective than Heaps, and for all the same reasons you have listed in favor of Heaps in the past, it stands to reason that he would be improved with more snaps to develop that same timing with receivers and to let linemen learn his tendencies for blocking.

snocythe wrote:

I suggest all of you Riley guys, if you can't get behind Heaps, then just start following Georgia Tech, Nevada, or Air Force, because that is the type of football that you are hoping for.

You mean the #5, #28, and #48 scoring offenses? You mean teams with a combined record of 9-3? Two teams getting votes in the top 25? You spit that out like it's disgusting--have you seen our offense lately? You wouldn't rather have UNR, GTechs, or AFA's numbers this season?



I watch BYU because I am a fan of the school and I want them to succeed---not because I am a fan of a given offensive scheme. I would gladly have BYU switch to that type of offense if we could put up those numbers this season. But I guess you would rather have a "traditional BYU offense" with a 1-3 record and the #116 scoring offense. Who cares what offense we run as long as we are scoring points and winning? We aren't doing either yet with Heaps.

snocythe wrote:
Again, I think Heaps has the tools to be the guy, but he has a long way to go before we crown him the winner of anything--that's all I've said from day one--he needs to earn it like every other guy on the team. You guys bagged on Nelson because he only got to #2 on the depth chart because Gaskins stepped aside. Heaps is only #1 at this point because the injured guy he couldn't beat out finally got hurt bad enough to be taken out. Heaps hasn't earned anything at this point, and there is no reason at this point to think he won't be in the fight of his life next season for a starting job with healthy, fit, and matured competition in Nelson, Munns, and Lark. At this point it appears to be open season.