Hearing rumors on how it went down....

kiwibacon wrote:
Except for all the national media and even local media keeps from speculating. I just feel there is better things to talk about rather than to speculate about.

I agree with this assertion. However, based on years of honor code violations affecting student athletes, and observing how the process occurs from an outsiders perspective, I don't think it is speculative to say that the process needs to be improved for the sake of the students involved.

I can't believe the Honor Code Office jumped to conclusions before they had the real story from a reliable source.



That is almost like fans condemning the Honor Code Office based on rumors of their handling of a situation.

Y 4 Ever wrote:

I had heard dui from someone close to eammon brennan, so honestly, I'm clueless as to the real story.



the story above is the exact same story for several HC casualties in years; the squeaky wheel gets the grease,

If it was DUI, there would be a public police record, and someone from the media would have found it.

Not necessarily.. if he was stopped for DUI and only given a citation and not booked into jail then the arrest record wouldn't be there.. and the only way for someone to find out would be a GRAMA request for the report.. or if someone leaked the info that he was stopped and cited..

I heard he was "bangin' seven-gram rocks" with Charlie Sheen last month making "Sinatra, Flynn, Jagger, Richards -- all of them -- look like droopy-eyed, armless children." :lol:

Isola wrote:
I can't believe the Honor Code Office jumped to conclusions before they had the real story from a reliable source.



That is almost like fans condemning the Honor Code Office based on rumors of their handling of a situation.

Agreed. People are up in arms saying not to blame Davies or make accusations about what he did or didn't do, because we don't know. But people have no problem accusing everyone in the HC office of being vengeful, spiteful, and hateful. Actively seeking to destroy BYU athletics.



I think the wise course of action is to wait until we know more before we go around saying how poorly the HC office handled this situation.

Isola wrote:
I can't believe the Honor Code Office jumped to conclusions before they had the real story from a reliable source.



That is almost like fans condemning the Honor Code Office based on rumors of their handling of a situation.

I totally agree, thank you. I really have a hard time believe the HC office conducts it's business like some kind of gestapo (as some have stated)...which would put put President Monson in the role of Hitler, which I also don't buy.

tmoney35 wrote:

I can't believe the Honor Code Office jumped to conclusions before they had the real story from a reliable source.



That is almost like fans condemning the Honor Code Office based on rumors of their handling of a situation.

I totally agree, thank you. I really have a hard time believe the HC office conducts it's business like some kind of gestapo (as some have stated)...which would put put President Monson in the role of Hitler, which I also don't buy.

True tales of the BYU Honor Code:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uprjmoSMJ-o

ABYUFAN wrote:
True tales of the BYU Honor Code:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uprjmoSMJ-o

Well played... :lol:



The Spanish Inquisition is one of my all-time favorite Monty Python sketches. I have no rebuttal

tmoney35 wrote:

I can't believe the Honor Code Office jumped to conclusions before they had the real story from a reliable source.



That is almost like fans condemning the Honor Code Office based on rumors of their handling of a situation.

I totally agree, thank you. I really have a hard time believe the HC office conducts it's business like some kind of gestapo (as some have stated)...which would put put President Monson in the role of Hitler, which I also don't buy.

Serious...HC Office is like the security vans circling the MTC making sure the adults that voluntarily chose to be in the MTC stay in the MTC.

ESPN is reporting that BYU has stated that Davie's offense was not a crimanl act. That about does away with the DUI rumor.



I've been doing some research on the HC today and I was reminded again that part of the HC states that one of the aspects of following the HC is that you "Encourage others in their commitment to comply with the honor code".



Maybe this is what got Davies kicked off. He and Jimmer were probably walking to class one day and some student over heard Jimmer complaining about the HC and Davies said nothing....right there...clear violation.

1280 the Zone is openly reporting on air that Davies got a girl pregnant.



I don't see how they can report a rumor like that, it makes me sick. Very unprofessional in my opinion. :sick:

I've heard the same thing as Lawboy, with one additional detail that makes all the difference: what the other party confessed to was a violation of a much higher degree than what Davies had been telling his bishop--he was being less than forthcoming in an effort to avoid suspension etc.



Bishops take a harder line against people who don't come clean of their own still or who only tell party of the story to avoid worldly consequences. It shows their repentance isn't sincere yet.



If this is true, I completely understand a bishop or BYU taking basketball off the table to remove the incentive to hide things. Let him face these issues honestly and work it out once and for all.



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Maybe someone noticed he didn't take the sacrament last Sunday?



All I know is that he will be missed. I hope he is able to make all the changes he needs to make to either stay in school or get back as soon as possible. And if he never plays bball again I don't care. Right now I would like to see him be able to be a great example of someone who can make a mistake, learn and grow from it, and in a year or two be giving a fireside on his growth from his personal experiences. From everything I have read of his background (which is not a whole lot) he seems to have a great support structure. I am a fan of the players as well as the team and I always hope our players represent well. When they do make mistakes I pray for them to make the necessary changes in their life to learn and grow from it-not become bitter and resentful.

Isola wrote:
I can't believe the Honor Code Office jumped to conclusions before they had the real story from a reliable source.



That is almost like fans condemning the Honor Code Office based on rumors of their handling of a situation.

This definitely has merit. However, I'm not making assumptions. Carri Jenkins, the University spokeswoman said that BYU "became aware of the violation on Monday and that a review is under way," not that the investigation is concluded. (see quote below from Jay Drew's article in the SL Trib: http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars/51342026-88/davies-byu-team-code.html.csp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

BYU announced in a terse news release that Davies, a 6-foot-9 sophomore from Provo High, “will not represent the university on the men’s basketball team throughout the remainder of the 2010-11 season” because of a “violation of the BYU Honor Code.”



School spokeswoman Carri Jenkins said Tuesday night that the school does not release details regarding violations of the code. She said the Honor Code Office of the university owned and operated by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints became aware of the violation on Monday and that a review is under way.

I have merely argued that it is unwise, in my opinion, to act so quickly when a review is ongoing, as was officially stated. The swiftness and severity of the action, with barely one day's knowledge of the violation, gives the impression to everyone in the world that the violation is serious. In ESPN's First Take, I believe it was Skip Bayless who said something to the effect that the swiftness of the action confirms that Davies wasn't swearing at the barista at Starbucks or drinking coffee.



(http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/24584/video-first-take-debates-byus-honor-code" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)



I think it is safe to say that most everyone believes that BYU is not a heavy-handed institution. I was not the poster who compared the Honor Code office to the Gestapo. I think the Honor Code is a very important part of the BYU experience, and I am grateful it is in place. Thanks to the honor code, more than one of us was assisted in making it safely to a temple marriage.



However, the problem I see with the process is, again in my opinion, that the University releases too much information by even identifying that an honor code violation has taken place. Obviously it is a tricky thing with high profile students like athletes, because the media come asking questions, which is not generally the case with the average student.



There are a finite number of honor code tenets and it is common sense that some of those are serious, suspendable offenses and others are not. By taking swift and definite action, the University actually identifies, without giving details, that the offender has committed one of less than a handful of possible infractions for which such a punishment would be appropriate. Especially when the university clarifies as Carri Jenkins did in the article cited above, in her official capacity, that the offense is not related to any other possible university or team rule violation:

"Asked if the dismissal had anything to do with Davies’ academic standing, she said, “No. This is a violation of the honor code.”

Jay Drew is now also tweeting that

"BYU has announced that sophomore Brandon Davies' honor code violation is not a criminal offense."

So, what is left on the list of suspendable offenses? Really, one, maybe two plausible options.



My opinion is simply that the declaration to the world should be that an "unspecified violation of team and/or university rules" has occurred and as a result the player will be suspended. Maybe that wouldn't make a difference in the speculation that occurs, but it would definitely open up the possibility of many more infractions so that the student doesn't get so easily convicted of a particular offense in the eyes of the public.



I felt the same way with how Harvey Unga's situation occurred. He handled the media very gracefully, and humbly owned what he did. However, I just don't think that BYU should be part of helping the media or public identify what transgressions an individual has committed, as long as no laws of the land have been broken. Transgressions should remain in confidence between the individual and his or her ecclesiastical leader(s).



Sorry that was long, but I wanted to clarify that I have no beef with the Honor Code or the Honor Code office, only with the communication from the university that makes it easier to identify a young adult's transgressions. I am just grateful that when I go to see my bishop, that the church isn't officially announcing that I have violated a tenet of my faith that I committed to live when I joined the church, and thereafter publishing a specific list of the things I haven't done. ;)

CannonCougar85 wrote:
1280 the Zone is openly reporting on air that Davies got a girl pregnant.



I don't see how they can report a rumor like that, it makes me sick. Very unprofessional in my opinion. :sick:

This is precisely why I wish that BYU would be more vague about its official declarations. This kind of thing is nobody's business except that of the individuals involved and their parents and ecclesiastical leaders.

ltpwfdcm wrote:
I heard he was "bangin' seven-gram rocks" with Charlie Sheen last month making "Sinatra, Flynn, Jagger, Richards -- all of them -- look like droopy-eyed, armless children." :lol:

Charlie, I didn't realize you were a cougar fan!!!

snoscythe wrote:
If this is true, I completely understand a bishop or BYU taking basketball off the table to remove the incentive to hide things. Let him face these issues honestly and work it out once and for all.



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I agree with this post, but maintain that the incentive to hide things can be taken away without making it easier for everyone to identify what offense was committed.

Davies' main worry won't be that half the world guessed correctly or incorrectly what he did to get kicked out. His main worry will be that if, as at least one tweet reported, he is out for "at least the rest of this season", and that his future with the team and the university is "still being evaluated", he may be looking at a year to get back in good standing. If so, that trashes next season. If so, he probably will be playing somewhere else next year and trying to make something positive out of the mess. If he did get a girl pregnant, whether an abortion happened, an adoption, a single mother, or a quick wedding, all of those paths come with great challenges even after the repentance is over. If his transcript has a bunch of Ws on it by next week, he will potentially have some major catch up work to do somewherre else to be able to play next season. He has a lot of very real worries and big decisions to make. May he be prayerful and may we be prayerful in ihs behalf that he makes the best decisions relative to his eternal progression and that he does come out of this stronger.



BYU athletics will have to make due and it will not be easy. Look what happened to the football team last year when a key player was suddenly gone with little notice. Davies' loss will be felt this year, but even more so next year when Fredette, Emery, K Collinsworth, and at least one other senior, Logan Magnusson, are gone - and right when BYU fans start to expect a Sweet 16 run or better every year. Maybe the timing of this is kind for the coaches in that they will not win a NC and create that nightmarish expectation for the future. A tough rebuilding year just got tougher and as we saw in football that can be devestating to careers.

PS - the suddenness of the Basketball part of the decision may have been as simple as Coach Rose calling in Brandon and saying - hey I heard the following from the University Standards Office - is this true? - and Brandon answering - yes. If the answer was no, then there would have been a slower action / reaction until the story sorted itself out.



I absolutely refuse to believe that BYU kicked a player off the team based on a disputed circumstance without due process.

I hope everyone remembers that this is a 19 year old boy who, no matter what he did and what he signed, should NOT have to go through this type of public thrashing! This is wrong! I don't think many adults could handle this situation. If you would be willing to stand in public and let all your dirty laundry be aired, then by all means, keep tearing down and speculating.